Saudi Arabia/USA: Reaction to Death of Usama bin Laden

Some of Usama bin Laden’s family members are speaking out that the United States violated international law when U.S. forces killed bin Laden on 01 May 2011 in Abbottabad, Pakistan.  Omar bin Laden, one of Usama’s 19 children, is the most vocal stating that the United States violated its own premise of “innocent until proven guilty” and challenging that other prominent figures identified as enemies, such as late Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein had his day in court. Why was an exception made of his father who was unarmed when discovered by U.S. forces?

Personally I believe bin Laden’s intent to harm and guilt were made clear in the many messages which he broadcast since 2001 taking credit for acts of terrorism and directing his followers to kill those who did not share his beliefs.  In fact, bin Laden’s messages were clear that if fellow Muslims did not share the same beliefs they were also considered fair game!  He fulfilled the requirements to be deemed an enemy combatant. I believe bin Laden would have never allowed himself to be taken alive by the “Great Infidel.”  There is also the issue that if he had been taken alive it is likely further acts of terror and uprising would have ignited like the flames of the great Chicago fire.  In spite of the death of Al Qaida’s mastermind, the world continues to face threats of terror.

Omar bin Laden further contests that the United States had no right to bury his father’s body at sea.  The (bin Laden) family should have been given custody of the body. The disposition of bin Laden’s body at sea is a delicate issue. If bin Laden’s body had been buried in a Muslim cemetery anywhere in the world that location would likely have become both a shrine and a target.  Yet on the other hand, was it ethically correct for the United States to conduct a ‘burial’ at sea of the body when there could have been a traditional Islamic burial?

While Usama was disowned by his family and stripped of his Saudi citizenship in 1994, the bin Laden family remains a well known and respected family in Saudi Arabia.  The Saudi bin Laden Group, a global oil and equity management conglomerate, is also one of the largest construction firms operating in the GCC.  There are members of the bin Laden family who continue to retain close ties with the Saudi ruling family and prominent American officials.


129 Responses

  1. Interesting

  2. Does anyone think that bin Laden was going to come peacefully? Unlike conditions when Saddam Hussein was captured, the US was not in control of the situation. If any kind of standoff occured there would very likely have been a firefight with the Pakistan Army. Does anyone doubt many lives would have been lost (remember the Red Mosque in Pakistan)?

  3. Jerry that is an interesting though considering according to Bedu they were so close to the military academy.

  4. Jerry that is an interesting thought considering according to Bedu they were so close to the military academy.

  5. Carol…

    What are the rules of burial for Mulsims? Is it before sunset or s certain time frame? Could the body have been brought back that quickly if so? Is burial at sea not allowed? Muslims get upset when a quran is burned yet that is one of the preferred way to dispose of one isn’t it?

  6. @Obey,

    I think you have to give a lot of credit to the Obama team for the meticulous planning. Not just on the military operations, but also the details on how they handled things like getting rid of the body before a media frenzy starts. Here are some thoughts:

    – No one wants a prolonged trial that turns into a media circus. I think he could have been captured, but the preference was to kill him. They used a rule in the engagements of war, if the person does not put his hands up in the air or wave a white flag, you can shoot him. So the plan was to shoot him except under the very unlikely scenario he does one of those 2 actions.

    – They also planned to get rid of the body as soon as possible to avoid the media attention and people demanding to see direct evidence. I think it is wise not to have the radicals get up in arms demanding handing the body over for Islamic burial, which may result in riots. So the administration used the Islamic tradition of burying a person before sunset. This is not a requirement, but a preference that can be lifted for special circumstances (this is one such situation). Islam also allows burial at sea, but it is for situations where a person died at sea. I think the administration was extremely clever to use these 2 technicalities to get rid of the body fast.

    I think this will go down as one of the best planned and executed operation of all time.

  7. It is outrageous to see Osama’s son Omar bin Laden statement that: Sea burial of OBL “demeans and humiliates his family and his supporters and … challenges religious provisions and feelings of hundreds of millions of Muslims”.

    Yet somehow the mass murder of 3,000 people in the name of Islam doesn’t demean or humiliate his family and his supporters, or challenge religious provisions and feelings of hundreds of millions of Muslims????

  8. ” challenges religious provisions and feelings of hundreds of millions of Muslims”.

    — why do we think it’s okay to speak on behalf of a million people just because we follow the sme scriptures!!!!

    i have no doubt Osama’s kids are grieving, but it’s colosally egoistic to think millions are grieving with you..
    oh well everyone likes their 2 min in fame..

  9. I think it is ridiculous to call bin Laden’s death ‘illegal’ especially from a son who disowned him because he KNEW he was a killer. Was Omar hoping to have a huge funeral and write another book?

    Why should his body be turned over to a family that disowned him? And if there are some who didn’t disown him then they are most likely ‘wanted’ themselves so they would have to be arrested on sight.

    I also agree that it is ridiculous to give him a religious burial considering that he was supposedly NOT A REAL MUSLIM (but remember, my daughter argued with me that he WAS).

    I hear that they are going to show his death pics to congress members if they wish to see them and to any of bin Laden’s family that wants ‘proof’ I can’t believe that they wouldn’t have any pics of his ‘Islamic’ burial at sea for those who want him to have been treated with respect. For those who wanted him to have a proper Islamic burial, where, exactly did they want him buried and could they have gotten that country to accept his body?

  10. I applaud President Obama’s wise decision to dump Osama dead body into the Martyr’s Sea, with full islamic rites; already named as such by his fan club in his honor. His mansion villa in Abbotsville (quickly turning into a shrine) has also been nicknamed as Osamaville, as a term of endearment for the great mujahed,

    President Obama did Muslims a great favor. Now the moderate Muslims can champion that Osama’s version of Islam had nothing to do with the ‘real’ Islam. That rather than him spouting Koran and Hadith, chapter and verse, in support of his actions, Osama’s revealing image lies beneath the Martyr’s Sea.

    As this is how Islam was founded. The peaceful “no compulsion” with 100-strong-followers, Muhammad was but a blip in the rise and rise of the man. The reign of terror, as enjoined in the koran, the hadith and the sunna, from Islam’s very inception to the present, still haunts the Muslim mind and has spurned the actions that now threaten the world.

    The candy-coated Islam will never arise unless Muslims acknowledge the individual rights of each other, first in the acknowledgement that things done in the past to protect, defend or spread Islam can no longer be practised today.

    On another note, I read an online article recently in the Miami Herald by Scott Cannon, a syndicated columnist for McClatchy News Service, titled “How bin Laden Changed This Country”. In it he describes Osama as the man who came to symbolize a bloody rejection of all things United States, and left a legacy among those he hated.

    Whether one agrees with this article or not, it is an informative and interesting read:

  11. Another photoshopped pics? Come on America, it is so obvious its all a fake and a nice hollywood movie. You are more intelligent than this. They were worried peiople will make a shrine or do something like that. Since when are they worried about what Muslims will do. And did they not worry that people will ask to be shown the body?

    They publishbed fake pics and then showed the people watching live feeds from Pakistan while they attacking the “Osama” house. It is so clear that they were all posing. Good actors. If it was true why not show some real pics…

    And when did Christians/atheist or whatever start doing islamic burial rituals?

  12. @Sarah – Who said a Christian/Atheist did the burial rituals? We DO have Muslims in our government and military. They said that a Muslim performed the rituals.

    Who is the ‘They’ that published fake pictures? Weren’t they in a Pakistani paper?

    And again who was the ‘they’ that showed live feeds of the attack on the ‘Osama house’. That was never shown here so who would have shown something like that and why?

    Also, who is the ‘they’ that was concerned about a shrine being made? Again, that would be the Muslim countries that REFUSED his body because they did not want the headaches of dealing with something like a shrine for him.

    Does that not sound plausible to you? I would love to hear from the leader of a country that says they would have gladly taken his body.

    And I really would love to know who the ‘they’ is that you keep referring to.

  13. But Sarah, I tend to agree with you that Osama bin Laden is most likely NOT dead so we better just step up our actions to root him and all his supporters out where EVER they may be. Agree?

  14. @Sarah,

    As expected, we all knew you will come here with conspiracies.

    1) The Obama administration never released any pictures or videos. So everything you see on the net is fake, created by people who get a rise out of creating conspiracies such as the one you’re promoting.

    2) The Obama administration does not really care about the conspiracy theories. There will be a few no matter what they do. The objective was to get rid of the body as soon as possible so there will not be mass protests by nutters. The only people needed to be convinced of the killing are ones that use reason and so far they have achieved that.

    3) The technicalities about the Islamic burial are just to provide a cover for the fast disposal of the body. It worked in principal.

    I know people like you will go all over the net making up stories etc. At the end of the day it does not matter. The man is dead (lets tray that in Caps for effect DEAD) and what you say does not matter. Illogical people will always look for an alternative story even when the facts does not support them. Nothing new here 🙂

  15. Sarah…

    Sometimes you just kill me with the conspiracy theories…

    they have not released photos in the USA. Is it at all possible that the photos you are seeing are fakes someone from your (muslim) side did to whip up fervor? Obama said he wouldn’t release the photos as they are gruesome and I agree with him… we do not need to see his head blown off. As much as I despised him, I would have to draw the line there for myself personally. No matter how the USA handles it there will be someone who complains and even if we presented the dead body someone would declare it a conspiracy/look alike. So guess what? The best thing is to ignore the people who shout conspiracies as they will always exist and not try to prove it to the world as there will never be agreement.

    Al Queda themselves claimed it was true…or did we get them to cooperate with us too?

    Lynn is right…there are muslims in the military who could perform that service. Even if there weren’t, clergy in the military are well versed in multiple religious rituals to serve their military.

    I think his burial place would definitely become a shrine. Which as you know is against Islam. No one should be worshiped other than Allah and he should have no partners. Personally, I think he could have easily been elevated to almost god like status for some people.

    Sarah…you almost sound like you don’t want to believe that he is gone. That couldn’t be right, could it?

  16. MoQ…

    I was typing and posted while you were so I sound similar…

  17. @Oby,

    “….so I sound similar”

    I am very impressed with your thoughts 🙂

  18. MoQ..

    Thanks! I take that as high praise indeed. 🙂

  19. “And when did Christians/atheist or whatever start doing islamic burial rituals?”

    maybe they never did, maybe they just tugged him out to the deck and tossed him overboard !!! how does it matter?

  20. look at that family tree.. 58 kids !!!!!!!!! oh my god for what ???
    at the rate this family was going in undr 3 generations they could populate and live in their own small country.

    This man must have been very very fond of children or most likely have no access to birth control. uggg what a burden on planet earth…

  21. I find it absolutely hilarious that Muslims are making his burial such an issue…seriously…after how the man lived his life, the things he did personally or at least condoned while claiming to be Muslim (while many Muslims never refuted this claim and others made excuses for him) and yet now all of that is forgotten and the focus is on what was done to his now dead body.

    Who. Cares. Do Muslims ask what happens to the dead bodies of those nonMuslims that were beheaded, killed etc in Saudi, Iraq, Pakistan? Do they get on the net and make a big deal and point accusing fingers of …hey…we as Muslims arent treating those nonMuslim bodies with religious sanctity prescribed by their chosen religion…bad on us…we need to feel shame AND be proactive in changing our ways.

    Personally when someone has been shown to be a murderer, callous and uncaring of human life…then they can be shot in the head and burned on the spot for all I care…quid pro quo. Why are we meant to respect that last rights and body of a dead man who did nothing by way of respecting the lives and rights of those still alive?

  22. COOLRED: “ …. Do Muslims ask what happens to the dead bodies of those nonMuslims that were beheaded, killed etc in Saudi, Iraq, Pakistan?”

    “Good” muslims follow the example of their prophet as documented in the hadith, when it comes to proper protocol for burial of non-muslims. It started early in islam with the prophet not following proper burial rituals himself for christian/jews slain in the many victorious battles muslims fought.

    According to Hadith (Tabari VIII:35 & Ishaq:464), after the muslim victory in the Battle of Qurayza (near Medina), prophet ordered his muslim army to dig trenches. Then 800-900 jews were beheaded in batches and their bodies were dumped unceremoniously into those trenches, without any religious rites. Young jewish boys (with no pubic hair) were spared and made into slaves.

    Perhaps that was the norm of the day in the 7th century for all religions???

  23. Coolred, I find the burial issue funny as well. For over 3 years of reading Muslim blogs, I was informed that OBL types had hijacked the beloved religion of peace, he was not a true Muslim, blah, blah, blah. But now…now he suddenly needs an Islamic burial? What?! Why?! Because he truly WAS a Muslim and all that stuff that he did really can be found in your holy book?? They amuse and confuse me…these burialers.

    Radha, I agree. Too.many.children. My goodness, people! Does the world really need that much of your precious seed out there?

  24. SARAH: “Another photoshopped pics? Come on America, it is so obvious its all a fake and a nice hollywood movie. You are more intelligent than this.”

    The belief in “conspiracy theories” by Sarah and many others in the muslim world reflects the general malaise afflicting the muslim world i.e. inferiority complex. While muslims as individuals may feel their religion is superior to that of unbelievers; however collectively muslims and the muslim world is undergoing a severe traumatic sense of inferiority complex, developed over centuries.

    Consider this: What if an entire civilization developed an inferiority complex? What ramifications would that have on the rest of the world? How would such paranoia play itself out in the interaction of civilizations?

    An Arabic op-ed piece titled “The Broder Dilemma and Inferiority Complex,” written by a Muslim intellectual Khaled Montaser late last year, portrays the Muslim world as suffering from just such an inferiority complex. Because it is immensely frank and exposes an important phenomenon, below is an abridged english translation:

    We Muslims have an inferiority complex and are terribly sensitive to the world, feeling that our Islamic religion needs constant, practically daily, confirmation by way of Europeans and Americans converting to Islam. What rapturous joy takes us when a European or American announces [their conversion to] Islam—proof that we are in a constant state of fear, alarm, and chronic anticipation for Western validation or American confirmation that our religion is “okay.” We are hostages of this anticipation, as if our victory hinges on it—forgetting that true victory is for us to create or to accomplish something, such as those [civilizations] that these converts to our faith abandon.

    And we pound our drums and blow our horns [in triumph] and drag the convert to our backwardness, so that he may stand with us at the back of the world’s line of laziness, [in the Muslim world] wherein no new scientific inventions have appeared in the last 500 years. Sometimes those who convert relocate to our countries—only to get on a small boat and escape on the high seas back to their own countries.

    The dilemma which we Muslims imbibed from one end of the earth to the other—by way of our sons, our intellectuals, our youth, our elders, our men and our women—regards the German writer Henryk Broder. We celebrated him through our media and Internet sites, saying that he had converted to Islam, because he said “I have been saved from misguidance and have come to know the truth, returning to my natural state [fitriti, i.e., Islam].” Our writers and intellectuals portrayed Broder’s statement as a slap to Germany’s face, since he was one of the most critical opponents of Islam, but now he had announced his repentance.

    Then the truth was immediately revealed and the embarrassing predicament which we imbibed of our own free will: for Broder is not to blame; he merely wrote a sarcastic article—but we are a people incapable of comprehending sarcasm, since it requires a bit of thinking and intellectualizing. And we read with great speed and a hopeful eye, not an eye for truth or reality. Some of us are struck with blindness when we read things that go against our hopes.

    We actually imagined that the man was speaking truthfully and sincerely! Thus we drank from the bitter cup of failure and shame, products of our chronic ignorance and contemptuous feelings of inferiority and detestability.

    [Note: despite the fact that it is now common knowledge that Broder never converted, many popular Arabic/Muslim websites—including Al-Islam Al-Youm (Islam Today) Al-Sharuk News, Al-Moheet—continue to gloat under headlines like “Famous German embraces Islam after his long struggle against it.”]

    How come the Buddhists don’t hold the festivities we do for those who convert to their religion? And some of these converts are much more famous than Broder. Did you know that Richard Gere, Steven Seagal, Harrison Ford—among Hollywood’s most famous actors—converted to Buddhism? What did the Buddhist countries of Asia do regarding these celebrities? What did the Buddhists in China and Japan do?

    Did they dance and sing praise and march out in the streets, or did they accept these people’s entrance into Buddhism as a mere matter of free conviction? When Tiger Woods, the most famous golf player and richest athlete in the world, discussed his acceptance of Buddhism, did China grant him citizenship, or did Japan pour its wealth on him? No, being self-confident, they treated him with equality, not servility.

    It is sufficient for the Buddhists that these celebrities purchase their nations’ electronic goods—without any beggary or enticements.

    Please do not use paste copy, try to keep your comment terse. If you think a large portion of text should be read put up a link. Moderator

  25. Harry…

    did you get this piece from Raymond Ibrahim’s website? I googled it to find the whole thing in English and he came up…I read his Bio…interesting guy. Born of Egyptian parents in the USA he evidently has made a lifelong study of Islamic civilization. The thing that I found super interesting is this quote:

    “The terrorist strikes of 9/11 played a pivotal role in Mr. Ibrahim’s formative outlook. As he explains in the Chronicle of Higher Education, when the terror attacks occurred in 2001, he was in the midst of doing research for his M.A. thesis, which centered on the role of the jihad in the early Islamic conquests. Immediately after 9/11, Raymond—then a student of history and theology, not politics and current events—began reading up on al-Qaeda and other Islamist organizations; he began watching Al Jazeera.

    He was immediately struck by the continuity evident between the words, deeds, and goals of the 7th century mujahidin (“jihadists”), whom he had been studying for years, and the near verbatim words, deeds, and goals of 21st century jihadists. Since then, he has maintained that to truly understand contemporary Islam(ism), one must first understand Islamic history, doctrine, and epistemology.”

    I have heard that so often from some bloggers here. (no names mentioned to protect the innocent…LOL!)

    I didn’t mean to digress but his studies and conclusions seemed to support the post you put up.

    If you are interested in reading him:

  26. A family cannot disown a son and then worry about where he is buried.

  27. Oby,

    Thanks for the link to his website. I actually got it from the religion of peace website. Thanks!


  28. Lynn, don’t you read the news?
    They means the US. You are being decieved, lied to over and over again. They are playing you and yet you do not see. They are taking you as being stupid and I am surprised why the general public show them to be just that,

    OBL has been dead on ice for years. This is all a big fake. There are so many unanswered questions. Where is the “shk” who performed the janazah, why not show release any pics except for those fake posed pic of them watching the live feed.

    Obama’s certificate is also a fake. Come on open your eyes. See the real picture.

  29. Oby,
    I think you got it wrong. These are facts not conspiracies. it is not if he is dead or not, it is about how “they” are playing you. OBL was created by US, War on terrorism was created by US and all the war in Muslim countries are created by US. Do you think this fake OBL is the only one with the fishies? Don’t believe it!

    I ask you if Muslims make a shrine and go round it many times a year, what do the Americans care about that? They never cared about killing Muslims or their own people so why this new found care for what the Muslims will do. Show the body to the world. Show some of the live feeds.

    “Sarah…you almost sound like you don’t want to believe that he is gone. That couldn’t be right, could it?”

    I knew he was gone almost 10 years ago (from sickness) and he was on ice. This was even mentioned by Madeline Albright. Benezair Bhutto mentioned about the death of OBL in an interview.
    Dr. Steve Pieczenik, who is the real inside man who knows what is going on, he told the whole story. You can listen to his interview in the link below. It is a 7 part interview. Can be boring but it is verrry interesting and mind blowing. Listen to it:

    “maybe they never did, maybe they just tugged him out to the deck and tossed him overboard !!! how does it matter?”

    That seems more likely. What do they care if they follow rituals or not. They just want to save face in the crumbling economy and mistakes of civilian presidents.

  30. @This post is dedicated to SARAH to make her feel betterv:)-

    What if, in a daring raid, on Osama’s vast hideout mansion in Abbotabad, Saudi Special Forces had captured or killed Osama. This article by a pakistani journalist takes a satirical (and funny) look at and hints at such a possibility ….

  31. Thanks for the link, Harry. It was funny in a boring way but enjoyed it nonetheless.

    It wouldn’t matter to me who did what to OBL or UBL as long as they are truthful and not deceiving the public.

  32. @Sarah – LOL Why no response to my questions? It would be easier to buy into these conspiracy theories if you could explain how the US is to gain by these supposed things you accuse it of. But, since I have not seen these things that you are talking about (I did see the dead OBL pic that the PAKISTANIS put out) since I have NOT seen what you say is out there then it seems that ‘they’ are not playing ME but they are playing YOU! LOL

    But, seriously, if you are for real and not just messin’ with us then I think that is really very scary. It must be a very scary world for you. But, I bet that doctors could help you if you asked.

  33. Lynn, what answers; listen to the link for all your answers. A fake certificate just before OBL’s killing – all a nice gimmick for the election time. When Pres does not have to worry so much – he got peace prize even before he did anything – lol. I must say – a nice but sick joke.

    They are playing YOU!

  34. Sarah…

    I want you to explain why if ten years ago he was dead, why the USA continued in the search for him…please don’t tell me it is a war on Islam or Muslims because that is the biggest load of s*** to be foisted on Muslims by their governments. If we were after Muslims and Islam we would start at home and discriminate NOT protect them. We would limit their abilities to build mosques through the federal government. Is there some racism? Hell yes! But they are protected the same as anyone else.

    So tell me Sarah why would the USA almost bankrupt itself in this stupid war on terror? 3 TRILLION dollars. Muslims must have a very high regard for yourselves if you think that we have nothing better to do with our money than spend it trying to exterminate Muslims. AND if that were the case I think it could be done in a much more efficient way. Why not just start with kicking them out of the USA? Then work our way across Europe? pushing them all back to the Middle East? Why instead when we are faced with refugees from these wars do we take them into our countries? If we were trying to destroy Muslims don’t you think the easiest place and the place we have most control would be in our own countries?

    I know it is really hard for you to believe, but the USA does care about Muslims and does care about it’s Muslim military. That is why they provide space for prayer and do not discriminate against them.

  35. Oby, are you really that naive – sorry for saying that.
    They are kept the world thinking that they are looking for OBLl they have their own agenda. They even said that they will freeze his body and use it when it becmes necessary. It is ont record that OBL was suffering from Marfan (spl) syndrome and he died from it. (he also had kidney issues). He was in Dubai hospital where was visited by American ppl from th gov.

    They are not fighting against the Muslims (yes at the back of it all it is the issue) but for now the problem is stay in power – super power. They do not care about their own people let alone Muslims.

    Oby, I ask you to listen to the interview, you will be surprised. And this is not from some cons theorist. He is the inside man – who knows and read the records.

    I feel that Americans do not see these things as an outsider does – the flaws in their plans but i am sure Americans are not that stupid. And many of them know what is going on.

  36. I didn’t watch that link you posted. Why would I? He didn’t interview anyone, right? He just TALKED about other people and what they said. And the one main person was a FICTION AUTHOR. Wth? Seriously? You take that stuff seriously? And you think that I am the one being played? LOL Yet still you haven’t given us a REASON they are playing me, have you?

    Another glaring problem with them taking OBL off of the ice and faked his recent death. Wouldn’t BUSH and the republicans have wanted him ‘killed’ under their administration? Or were they Democrats that put him on ice so many years ago and waited for a nice Democratic president so that they could give him the credit for the kill? Then why did they wait so long, Obama has been in office a long time. What were they waiting for?

    WHO IS THEY???

  37. Sarah..


    You might find this interesting. It is a you tube video that shows a photoshopped face of dead “OBL”. They show the real dead face of the person it actually is and with bin ladens face superimposed. Looks real but DOSEN”T match the description the USA said OBL actually looked like.

    Video link removed by request of the commentator

  38. I meant, I didn’t watch the WHOLE thing.

    Who was the inside man? That guy on that link? Really?

  39. Everyone…

    My sincerest apologies. I posted this link but I didn’t realize it would show the actual video grab before playing. I thought you could open at your discretion. I have put in a request to remove it and I am SINCERELY sorry for anyone who might be freaked out by it.

  40. Sarah, it is always the “other” then, right? All the troubles in this world are the work of evil people who just happen to be non-Muslims, americans, jews, whatever….

    This mentality is standard for Muslims. They can be right next to a Muslim, with a sword in one and and the Quran in the other, standing on a pile of dead bodies, and see no evil. Yet a cartoon will make them froth at the mouth. Yes, of course, blame others by all means, for everything. Remember only Islam and Mohammad are perfect. Bow down to your prophet. Bless his name. Tell him you love him. Nothing matters but his words. Even his actions mean nothing because you know in your heart that everything he did was wonderful. Even the many things that if done by others would be evil are really wonderful deeds because he did them and you know that everything Mohammad did is perfect and because Muslims do what he did that is OK, too.

    Sarah is a typical, everyday, normal, grade A, blue ribbon, standard issue Muslim. She has blind, absolute faith and knows that if sh!t happens, it must be the “other” making it happen. That is the only logical thing, right?

    She will believe everything except that Islam and her dear prophet could be wrong, so it is just a matter of selecting someone, something to blame.

    BTW, that “they (Americans) never cared about killing Muslims or their own people” line is priceless today, given the bombs in Pakistan killing dozens of Muslims, again, and again. It must of been one of those suicide Christians doing it to get to heaven and receive his 72 harps. (I say harps because I have no idea what christians get in Paradise, except clouds and harps).

    Yes, there is an inferiority complex, but worse is the need to silence the other. Muslims cannot take criticism. It hurts them. Criticism makes them think about things they would rather forget or ignore That is why Muslims consider “criticism” to be the same as “persecution”. Uncaring Westerners don’t understand this and shame on them. They should be more sensitive to Muslim feelings. That is why Muslims need to kill apostates and critics.

    I leave you a statement by one of the few Muslims willing to face reality.

    Quote: I have to admit that our current Islamic teaching creates violence and hatred toward Non-Muslims. We Muslims are the ones who need to change. Until now we have accepted polygamy, the beating of women by men, and killing those who convert from Islam to other religions.

    We have never had a clear and strong stand against the concept of slavery or wars, to spread our religion and to subjugate others to Islam and force them to pay a humiliating tax called Jizia. We ask others to respect our religion while all the time we curse non-Muslims loudly (in Arabic) in our Friday prayers in the Mosques.

    And so on.

    I found that posting while looking for Muslim blogs about Egypt and the current mess. It is obvious to me that millions of Copts are at grave risk of being slaughtered. Of course, to Sarah, if this happens it is really the Americans and jews manipulating those poor, innocent Muslims into doing this. Everybody knows Islam is a “religion of peace”, right?

  41. “Or were they Democrats that put him on ice so many years ago and waited for a nice Democratic president so that they could give him the credit for the kill? Then why did they wait so long, Obama has been in office a long time. What were they waiting for?”

    They were waiting to see his reelection chances and when it seemed Trump’s campaign was gaining momentum and the Donald even made Obama produce a long birth certificate which McCain, Palin, etc never could do, they decided now was the time to take UBL off the ice. It was time to trump Trump!

    So smart folks that they are (those Democrats you mentioned who had UBL) decided to interrupt The Apprentice to make the death of UBL the biggest news in a decade, turn the tide back to Obama for President in 2012 and – tada! – end of story!

  42. Sarah…

    I have spent the last half an hour looking for the statement by Albright. This is what I found:

  43. Susanne, thank you! That DOES make perfect sense now! I thought that was an AWESOME play!! LOL How can we have anything BUT the utmost respect for someone who could trump The Donald like that? LMAO

    I bet ‘they’ could also get ‘them’ to change the Constitution so Obama could be President For Life. Oh yeah! ‘They’ could do ANYthing now that ‘they’ got bin Laden. 🙂 But wait a minute. Obama is a MUSLIM so WHY is he pretending to hate Muslims so much? OMG, my head is spinning now. I think I’ll take a break now and go outside and pull some of those damned WEEDS that those freakin’ MUSLIMS planted in my garden! It HAD to be them that did it. 😉 and I hope ‘they’ get them all once and for ALL! I hate weeding!

  44. LMAO,

    Oh come on everyone. Just sit back and enjoy Sarah’s analysis. You are all naive and have been fooled for years by the US government from the time of the Reagan administration when the OBL character was invented (yes there were clones to perform in all of those videos since his death 10 years ago). Luckily we have Sarah who with her logical and detective capabilities (unmatched since the real Sherlock Holmes was sniffing for clues using his magnifying glass), has uncovered the entire plan.

    Please do not interrupt her with those silly questions. Just kick back and enjoy the comedy.

    Sarah, I know this is 10 years late, but please forgive me for not knowing, due to all the deception that has been going on. I am very sorry for your great loss!!!

  45. First Bin Laden was armed, then he was not. First Bin Laden used his wife as a human shield then he did not. First Bin Laden was shot on sight then he was shot only after being captured first. First Bin Laden’s compound was a plush million dollar mansion then it was a dirty house with no air conditioning worth a quarter of that.

    The truth behind the raid and the alleged assassination of Bin Laden is moving further away from the dramatic tale President Obama told the nation on Sunday night with each passing day. But that’s to be expected from a US military-industrial complex that has a habit of manufacturing fables to dupe the American public into accepting the delusion that is the “war on terror”.

    Take for example the gargantuan psychological warfare salvo that the US government launched against its own people in the immediate aftermath of the Jessica Lynch “rescue”.

    Fact is that three helis appeared. Two never touched down in the city but went off to pass some time of about 40 minutes in a nearby place called Kala Dhaka. The one that landed, dropped some US and Afghan soldiers. And then came back some 20 minutes later. When it took off, it was shot down by the anti aircraft. That is why you do not see the remains of a “blown up” heli. Everyone in the heli was killed. That is why you will NEVER see any photographs and the only one released was that of April 2009.

    Chirac as president had ordered an inquiry into how the news of OBL had leaked out. OBL died of renal failure a long time back.

    Not many of you have been to the place in mention, I suppose. But for those who have not, let me assure you and you are welcome to come see and experience it yourselves, an Arab family living there for 5 years would have stuck out like a sore thumb. That is still a place where when you send a letter, you really do not need an address.

  46. Holy Sinner or Sarah or Whoever, Could you please tell us what came of French President Chirac’s investigation? Got any links?

    Also, were those reports that came out saying one thing and then the other thing, WHO put those reports out? Were they all from the same reliable source? Can you give us some links to back that up?

    ‘an Arab family living there for 5 years would have stuck out like a sore thumb’

    LOL Are you talking about the bin Laden refuge in Abbottabad? Where no one ever saw anyone? The place where the neighbor kids couldn’t even retrieve a ball but were paid for it instead if it made it over the walls of the compound (I DO question THAT considering how high the walls were). So an unseen Arab family would have stood out but overly tall walls with razor wire DOESN’T? I couldn’t even believe when I heard that that is a COMMON thing there. They talk about the US being a dangerous place to live but never, in ALL my years have I seen Americans have to resort to living in a fortress.

  47. I think holy sinner has the smoking gun here “First Bin Laden was armed, then he was not.”, pun intended of course….

    Oh common Lynn, why are you arguing against evidence. Sarah and Sinner have provided you with all the evidence you need to believe Osama died 10 years ago. It is just you cannot see it, like the evidence for a God. Have faith and every fantasy fits perfectly!!!

  48. Sarah, you are completely deluded. Truth is, Osama, (or Usama) bin Laden worked for the reptillians. It is part of the reptillian plan to disrupt world peace and keep people fighting. Donald Trump also works for the reptillians, only he has a better deal.
    So when Osama died ten years ago, from an overdosis of pot, the reptillians froze him, and now Trump, who has the Reptillian backing, is not doing so very well in the pre-elections, due to him having donated the larger part of his brain to the reptillian cause, they decided to let go of Osamas body, implant the brains of his wives and followers that he was there all the time,
    And then they planted the plan to attack the compaound into the brains of Obama and his staff, and so it all happened.

    Now the ultimate motive is of course, the Film industry which is wholly under control of the Reptillians, besides creating wars all over and diverting attention of people like Sarah and Holy sinner from the truth, they make lots of dough from Hollywood. So in a years time there will be at least three movies where the Americans are the heroes for taking out a big evil nasty mass murderer, and then there will be the conspiracy theory movies and documentaries, and the movies where the Americans are the bad guys for taking out a big evil nasty mass murderer.

    I hope all of you finally see it now.
    The truth is out there…

  49. Sarah…

    When presented with information, each of us has to make a choice what we will/want to believe. Unless we have ferreted out the info ourselves there is a certain amount of trust that has to go along with the position of belief that one takes.

    What makes your explanation of America trying to maintain their world power via wars in the Middle East MORE believable to you than they are trying to get rid of some crazy terrorists.

    I am wondering why it makes more sense to you that a country would spend so much money and put themselves in some financial stress to retain their world power status?Don’t you think a country in financial stress is less likely to retain power status? And why would they focus their attention on the Middle East which is arguably the poorest and most corrupt area on the planet instead of focusing on Europe or some other more advanced and peaceful countries so that they don’t have to fund conflict?

    I just don’t understand why, in the face of evidence…even al Queda saying he is dead (which I think would be a blow to them to admit) you insist that the scenario is so different. How does one come to that conclusion despite the preponderance of evidence?

  50. Well, Aafke, it all makes perfect sense when you put it that way 😉 But, I AM still a little confused about whether or not I’m supposed to hate Muslims.

  51. Lynn, The reptillians want you to hate Muslims so you shouldn’t.
    On the other hand, it is a well known fact that mohammed was, in fact, a Reptillian and so the whole of Islam is constructed to further the reptillian plan for world domination.

  52. Another friend of ours put forth the died a decade ago and preserved on ICE conspiracy to us last night. I almost fell off my chair ( but then it could be sleep too) .

    I think it makes people who like him feel better that he died by himself , so let it go.

    he’s probably enjoying himself right next to walt disney !!!!

  53. Aafke, Whew!! Thank goodness ’cause I love that little grandbaby of mine to pieces! 🙂

  54. I think Sarah and Holy Sinner are onto something. The frozen man story is real. Look at what they found when they reconstructed the face of Otzi. The only fact they did not get right was the number of years. It was not 10 but rather 5300.

    Great job you 2, i think you have uncovered one of the great mysteries of all time. Osma was cloned from Otzi DNA…..

  55. Radha, did that person really believe that? What did others say in response to this, um shall we call them Icers? lol

    I kinda thought he’s most likely died a while ago too. But it didn’t really matter just as it doesn’t matter now that he is dead. Doesn’t change anything really.

  56. All, I think we should have the “Golden Nutter Award” competition for the best deather story. Sarah and Sinner did give it a good try, but so far they are at Bronze medal position. Aaafke’s reptilian and Otzi are competing for Gold. With the Latter having a slight advantage for having video evidence.

    New entries are allowed for the next 24 hours.

  57. Moq, I don’t agree, I think my story is far more convincing precisely because there is no proof!
    The reptillians are far too clever to leave behind silly proofs like video’s… pleeease!

    Only those who have faith are amongst the chosen ones and can see the truth about the reptillians!

  58. lynn – there was no one else just them having dinner with me and F 🙂 and i almost fell out of my chair ( could be sleep too ) and F just had his usual stare !!!!

    What can you say at the face of such logic, this couple and us have a on-off relationship – mostly from their end. usually they don’t like us due to our mixed family, however recently F helpedthem when his dad came to the US and needed medical help.
    now they want their youngest to study with Mine for the SAT’s 🙂
    We’ll soon be on their bad list once i make it known that their girl can come home and hang out but i’d much prefer my daughter getting guidnace from my son ( tried and tested) i’m really not too much fro group study and nightly disruption in my household.

  59. The barbed wire around villas in Pakistan is not an uncommon site, especially in elite or restricted areas.

    Barbed wire around the property of a villa was typical for Saudi diplomats in Pakistan.

    Some folks would also choose to have glass shards glued to the top of the villa wall as well as the barbed wire….plus security guards.

    I do agree with Holy Sinner’s comment in that one would not need a street address to make a delivery in Abbottabad. An Arab would likely stand out but at the same time, the Pakistan Military Academy will have cadets and students from foreign countries which have included Arab states. Americans in residence in Abbottabad would stand out too.

  60. Lynn
    “I didn’t watch that link you posted. Why would I?”

    Why wouldn’t you? Are you afraid you will hear things that will rip your face off?

    Maybe you didn’t hear all of the video let alone all of the 7 parts. I know in the beginning it is boring before he actually starts talking to the Doctor. The man was working with the gov. He was Deputy Assistant Secretary of State and has also worked for the State Department. He also worked on several different influential positions under 3 different Presidents and still works with the Defense Department.

    They are playing the people making them thing something else while the reality is completely different.

    Bush and other would want to “catch” OBL while in power but maybe that is not the real issue. There is more to it than that.


    I did not see the link that you posted as it was taken off. So I can’t really comment

    Madeleine Albright admitted that they had killed Bin Laden. She said “Yes we have been told by intelligence that they’ve got him, Bush may roll him out but because they exposed that at the election they didn’t do it.”

    Bhutto said to David Frost in an interview “Yes but one of them is a very key figure in security, he is a former military officer … and had dealings with Omar Sheikh, the man who murdered Osama bin Laden“.

    Oby, even Al Qaida is just a creation of USA. It is just a reason group. Reason to do things according to their plan.

    What evidence are you talking about?

    If you had listened to the interview Pieczenik says he is ready to tell a federal grand jury the name of a top general who told him directly 9/11 was a false flag attack.

    If you cannot listen to the complete interview, read some of the interesting bits here:

    Excerpt from the interview:

    “He was already very sick from marfan syndrome and he was already dying, so nobody had to kill him,” added Pieczenik, stating that Bin Laden died shortly after 9/11 in his Tora Bora cave complex.

    “Did the intelligence community or the CIA doctor up this situation, the answer is yes, categorically yes,” said Pieczenik, referring to Sunday’s claim that Bin Laden was killed at his compound in Pakistan, adding, “This whole scenario where you see a bunch of people sitting there looking at a screen and they look as if they’re intense, that’s nonsense,” referring to the images released by the White House which claim to show Biden, Obama and Hillary Clinton watching the operation to kill Bin Laden live on a television screen.

    “It’s a total make-up, make believe, we’re in an American theater of the absurd….why are we doing this again….nine years ago this man was already dead….why does the government repeatedly have to lie to the American people,” asked Pieczenik.

    “Osama Bin Laden was totally dead, so there’s no way they could have attacked or confronted or killed Osama Bin laden,” said Pieczenik, joking that the only way it could have happened was if special forces had attacked a mortuary.”

    There are more links of other info on that page. Your questions are answered there, Oby. Its more than allowing prayer mats for Muslims showing their “love”.

    I realize that people who do not want to face reality will make it into something funny as people do here. But what they do not realize is that it will not change the facts.

    The killing of mammalian OBL is all a big hoax.

  61. Interesting that Al Qaeda and the Taleban seem to think we just killed him. And interesting that his Yemeni in-laws believed he was responsible for 9-11.

    The number of people who would need to conspire together on this story is impossible. The Pakistani’s-including the Government, and the folks in the neighborhood who heard the raid while it was in progress- also including the statements of Bin Ladens wives and in-laws, AL Qaeda, the Navy Seals and the the Executive branch of the US government- as well all the individuals in all these groups who keep up the pretense. Yep it must be a conspiracy all right. *snort*

  62. A general appeal to common sense…MH-60, the naval variant of UH-60, does not have the range to fly from Bagram to Abbottabad, hover for 40 minutes and fly back to Bagram and then to the sea! This would mean a continuous flight of 25 hours without time spent on refueling and a range about 13 times the range of the helicopter(s).

    Please tell me someone understands something to basic! There will never be picture(s) because there actually are none!

    It says 24 troops landed? Well, the heli can carry only 16!

    But since this is an appeal to common sense, I doubt it will be understood commonly.

    About the inquiry ordered by Chirac, it was hushed up. Just like the Bush administration had to hush up the “those weapons of mass destruction have GOT to be somewhere” fiasco by the Dick and Bush.

  63. It’s the reptilians which are behind Al Qaida!
    and actually osama was killed by the Americans but they like to confuse things by spreading conspiracy theories like this one Sarah shared with us.

    The Anti-Reptilian-Underground has transcripts of a meeting by the top-echelons of the Reptilian suppression committee, and the conspiracy theories to be released within the next five years were discussed. Amongst these theories were the ”9-11 was orchestrated by the Bush administration”, and this one ”Osama has been dead since ten years and kept on ice”.
    That, by the way, proves that they had already abandoned support of their former puppet Osama.
    Anyway, this ”10 years on ice” theory was hotly disputed by two new-comers to the cadre of top-reptilians, as being too silly and ridiculous to take root. But they were persuaded by the other, more experienced Reptilians that anything goes when it comes to human gullibility.

    And we see it does. Not only do Sarah and The Sinner swallow this ridiculous story hook, line and sinker, they even spread it around and actually defend this preposterous asinine ”theory”.

  64. No one is trying to convince you Aafke-Art. I am merely saying what is the truth. Like I said, other comments aside, read about the performance of the helis on or google it.

    Now you may like to believe in the Santa’s carriage but dude, these helis are not being pulled by reindeer. They will crash and burn if not refueled in this flying range. And they were NOT refueled. But understanding this will need an unbiased look into facts.

  65. There’s no need to convince me, I know!

  66. @Conspiracy Theories

    From reading quite a few of the online newspapers/ blogs in the muslim world, they are espousing the same conspiracy theories and crap, as Sarah and Holy Sinner. Like 9/11 was an “inside job” by the US and Osama was killed shortly thereafter and put on ice. Like muslim-on-muslim and muslim-on-kafir killings are being financed by CIA and Mossad. Like the raid on Osamaville in Abbotabad never happened since all the helicopters involved were shot down by pakistani air force and all the americans and afghans were killed. And the list goes on ….

    The belief in such and spreading of such bull**** by Sarah, Holy Sinner and many others in the muslim world reflects the general malaise afflicting the muslim world developed over centuries i.e. self-denial, despair, inferiority complex, etc. A scary question is: What if an entire civilization developed such syndromes? What ramifications would that have on the rest of the world? How would such paranoia play itself out in the interaction of civilizations?

    @Osama Bin Pervert

    There were news reports early today that American commandos who killed Osama Bin Laden found an extensive stash of modern pornographic materials, including many videos and dvds. As if Bin Laden watching himself on TV wasn’t pornographic enough.

    I had no idea that pornography was permitted in Islam. What a frigging Holy Sinner, huh?

    And then there are the three real widowed “desperate housewives” of Abbottsville, whom Osama ordained in his will never ever to remarry; following his Prophet’s example. Well, that’s a shame but you know what they say. The holed up multi-wife harem that plots mayhem and watches porn together, stays together:)-

  67. @Holy Sinner,

    You actually do not know what the helicopter capabilities are. It is a first time used stealth version of the blackhawk. The existence and capabilities of these helicopters are Top Secrete. So there is no way the web sites feeding you information can provide you with definitive information. Another issue you have in your statement is that you state that the blackhawks hovered for 40 minutes. When the mission details indicate that they landed not hovered. The chinooks are the helicopters that hovered.

    Also, there is physical evidence of a helicopter with stealth technology left at the compound. With large pieces remaining behind after the Seals blew it up. Some how you missed that and continued with your conspiracy.

    You are the one who seems to believe any story you read on the internet. This is because you are predisposed to a specific conclusion and looking for any information to support it. You disregard even physical evidence to make your fantasy stick.

    I know you are trying hard to win the Golden Nutter Award, but so far you only reached Nutter status. To become golden you have to exhibit more imaginative talent 😉

  68. And anyway, Osama bin Laden is dead because the FSM swapped him with his noodly appendage. The FSM had enough of the enormous number of innocent lives lost due to this murderous nasty evil person.
    Now usually the FSM does not intervene in what goes on in His creation, as He never really meant to create Earth and animals and humans and such, and He’s not really interested in what’s going on here, but a concertedd prayer effort by worldwide groups of pirates and pastafarians got His Attention at last, and He agreed to wipe out this blot, this scourge, this demonic personification of evil.

    And there you have it.
    The Flying Spaghetti Monster carried the helicopters with His noodly appendages, he added extra troops as He saw fit, even if they did not fit into the helicopters. You know, with the Almighty power of the FSM there’s always an explanation.
    And the Americans didn’t kill Osama, he was swatted by a noodly appendage.

    Now because unbelievers like you and Sarah do not understand His Mysterious Noodle Swinging that doesn’t mean you can just image weird unfounded conspiracy theories, much less spread them as the truth. Now the FSM might not intervene, but the Pastafarians and Pirates of the world will!
    We don’t like nuts in the celestial pasta dish.
    So beware!

  69. People divert from the real topic by talking about reptiles and awards because they have no answers or explanations for the things happening that are so clearly fake.


  70. @The Holy Sinner -‘A general appeal to common sense…’

    Can I just say, BAH hahahaHAHAHAHAhahahahaha!

    That’s a good one!

  71. Sarah, yarrr, ye silly lass! And ye think yur silly conspiracy theories are not de’iating from ye current subject matter???
    Toss a dram o’ rhum and chill, aye!

  72. Sarah…

    You still have not answered my question…

    Why do you find your version of truth more convincing even when Sandy pointed out how many people would have to be working together to make it happen…you think the USA has Pakistan, the military, the entire town in their back pockets?

  73. Oby, sorry I thought I did answer your question. I thin we both see it different. The way I see it and of course there are many American who beleive it is all a fake, that its always been a plan – right from the beginning. What was anthrax all about, what about WMD, many questions about 9/11 …etc but there are no answers. Allies are there to help to a certain extent and then they are dumped! Was not OBL working for america?
    Anyway I have to rush, will check your comment about the question you feel I did not answer – and Sandy’s.

  74. So Sarah,

    I think there are enough web sites out there that have discovered the existence of the reptilian alien conspiracy dating back to George Bush senior who was a reptilian himself. There are even pictures showing him transforming to his original form. I think that story is fairly accurate if you just have faith 😉

  75. President Obama, sir, if you are reading this could you please just settle this once and for all? We can handle the truth, can’t we guys?

  76. We want the long form truth….

  77. Lynn & Aafke,

    Here’s at least one version of the “truth” via a long form Obummer song ….

  78. Harry, that song must have been made BEFORE the act of bravery that took bin Laden out (allegedly).

    President Obama, don’t pay any attention to that link above. Harry doesn’t mean any disrespect, ever. 😉

  79. OK…since Harry put up his video I am going to put up my Obama video…someone sent this to me today and I have been dying to share it and here is a chance. It is a digression from the subject, but might be related obtusely as it talks about media. (Ok ok a stretch, but I am trying to make it fit. LOL!) Whether you are a fan or not it is amazing how people spin things sometimes…

  80. @sarah – “What was anthrax all about, ” — i don’t know or care about your other conspiracies. Maybe you are rught maybe noodle appendages rule !!!! 🙂
    but Anthrrax is real , and the scare was real .. how do i know. i was in CDC when testing materials came in ..
    I felt the fear, i felt the panic and i felt the urgency to our work… so my dear whatever else you say you are not even remotely qualified to comment on the details of Anthrax , you had to be there to know. again i’m not commenting on who did it :-).. people died that’s all that matters.

  81. @Oby – loved the video! Higher gas prices saves lives… speaking of which, who can advise what the cost of gas per liter is now in Saudi? I think it was about .15 cents a liter when we left.

    @Radha – maybe you even conducted tests on ‘my specimen.’ It turned out I was bitten by a brown recluse spider but apparently many of the initial characteristics to anthrax are the same. I was working at an embassy which had received some anthrax concerns at the time.

  82. Radha, please do not miss up her fantasies with facts.

    You know Sarah, loves every conspiracy theory ever concocted. We should help her a little to add to her collection:

    – Roswell, New Mexico
    – The grassy knoll
    – Babylon oppression
    – Bilderberg Group

    These are just a few of the 100’s, which I would love to hear Sarah’s expert opinion and impeccable analysis on 🙂

  83. oooh, Carol, maybe you could make a new tab and call it Conspiracy Theories and everyone could post all the best ones right there. It would make it much easier to keep up with all of them and every time someone wanted to talk about one they could just link back to the post so they don’t have to keep posting it over and over again. It would be an awesome read!

    If that works out then we could direct President Obama to THAT page and he could clear everything up for us. 🙂

  84. Radha,
    I did not say anthrax did not happen. Yes it did happen and people died from it. What I asked was what was it all about? Did they ever find out who did it? Right there in the gov buildings? I mean come on – it is so obvious. Because you have felt the panic and fear and saw things bought in for testing, or people dying, it does not make you an expert in what really goes on behind the scenes. I am not saying I am expert but you can listen to people who are inside and who speak.

  85. Oby,
    If OLB was dead 10 yrs ago, why were they searching for him all these years, you ask. How do you know they were searching for him? That is what they said they were doing but how sure are you? Isn’t it fishy that a whole army with all its sophisticated weapons and devices cannot find one weak and sick man in a cave? They did not find any major problems in finding Saddam in a hole. Why will they not spend 3 trillion dollars to achieve what they want? And oh yes it is your money they are using for this fake search-party, sending your men and women to fight a fake war on terrorism, killing people with your money. They don’t mind to get what they want with blood and sweat of other people.

    Why do you not consider what Pieczenik is saying when he is ready even to name the general responsible. After all he is/was there.

    OBL’s Yemenis in-laws think he is responsible for 9/11. Oh Ok, then he must not have done it.

    If they can pull off a huge stunt such as 9/11, raiding a house in Pakistan is nothing.

  86. Osama is dead. Accept it. Whether he died ten years back or at the hands of the seal does not matter his death was acknowledge by Al Qaeda which he lead.His body was not shown why bother it has been accepted by his enemies and families!
    Is it wrong to bury Muslims at sea, no, during the haj pilgrimage where traveling to Mecca could only be done by sea and land many people died. many were buried at sea.
    It is a fact that in US army some are Muslim so when the Army says Muslims rite has been conducted so be it. As Muslim we should say Alhamdullilah all praise be with God!!
    Whether a Muslim can condemn others as non Muslim when he is a Muslim because of his action the answer is no. When it comes to renounce a person is out of Islam because of his action it is not his duty to do so but left to God. A person like me might not pray 5 times a day might not fast during Ramdhan might fornicate and eat pork( I dont do it) I am still a Muslim unless and only if I renounce my faith verbally then I have apostate. My action alone render me kufur but still a Muslim!!
    By the way Muslims could also cremated their bodies it it is necessary to do so like in time of famine or plague!!!
    We are not reptiles we are human sadly we Muslims are never ever to self criticize their belief because of their fear that they will apostate!!!

  87. Alas! A general appeal to common sense has found no takers…nothing new. Stealth is achieved through paint, reduction in heat signature, sound and angled surface that refracts radar instead of reflecting it.

    This in no way means more fuel capacity. The helis that landed had three marks, two in the front and one at the rear. The heli was not blown by the marines. They could possibly not have blown the only heli they came in. The heli was taken down by the 40mm anti aircraft fire and that is a fact. But not for those who see a reindeer pulled cart coming in from the North Pole!

  88. LYNN: “…. maybe you could make a new tab and call it Conspiracy Theories and everyone could post all the best ones right there.

    Hmmm. That’s an excellent suggestion along with the Golden Nutter award!

    A pakistani journalist recently did a sartorial piece on emerging conspiracy theories surrounding Osama’ demise.

    Here are a few snippets gleaned from his article, which Sarah and Holy Sinner would love to love:

    There was no Osama in that compound in Abbottabad. The Americans killed a look-alike. The real Osama died of gall-bladder failure in a bush in Sudan in 2002. What’s more, his supposed wives that were captured from the Abbottabad compound too were look-alikes, and so were the children.

    So, in other words, the guy who the Americans claimed of killing in Abbottabad was really a look-alike of a look-alike of a look-alike of a look-alike. But if we really come to the truth and reality, things stop seeming so complicated.

    So what is this truth and reality? Simple. There never was an Osama. He was never born. It was all an American concoction.

    The radar that did not pick up American helicopters on May 2 was not a radar. It was a look-alike of the real thing that the Americans didn’t give us.

    Thus, not surprisingly, the 9/11 episode happened. We all know who was responsible. Not a single Jew died in that attack. Neither did any animists or pagans, nor any Hindus, Christians and Sikhs. The truth is, only Muslims died in that attack.

    The proof? Simple. Log on to YouTube and check out brilliant, award-winning documentaries, ‘Loose Nut’ and ‘The Drivels.’ Popcorn’s on the house.

  89. Yo where’s that popcorn?

    The real 411 is that the FSM killed OLB ASAP in an SUV, .while OLB was AWOL from his compound. AAR8 I think we should be grateful OLB is ABU and permanently DC.

  90. LMAO at the reason man,

    “This in no way means more fuel capacity. The helis that landed had three marks, two in the front and one at the rear. The heli was not blown by the marines. They could possibly not have blown the only heli they came in. The heli was taken down by the 40mm anti aircraft fire and that is a fact. ”

    How do you know all of the above (any reliable sources?). Sounds like stuff you just made up. Note the team was a Seal team not marines. Even simples stuff like that confuses you….

  91. Sarah…

    You are still not answering my question…maybe purposely. The bottom line is everyone has to take a side generally. You chose to believe what you believe because it fits with whatever you are looking for it to fit. Maybe you hate America, or maybe you take the side Muslims generally take because it is who you are surrounded by. Even though your scenario would take collusion on a world wide scale (with people..Pakistanis… who hate America thinking they aren’t really wanting to help us) you continue to believe it. Somehow in your mind it makes sense that a country would blow up their central economic center and kill 3000, then spend a fortune and put themselves in finacial distress and kill many of their soldiers for the “cause” not to mention innocent people. Not to mention Al Queda themselves have admitted that OBL was killed in this raid and just recently two al queda members blew themselves up (and claimed it) in the midst of the Pakistani army as retaliation for the killing of Osama and for the military being too weak to stop the USA. But I suppose that was the USA who actually did that too who got al queda to cooperate with them, not to mention all the countries in Europe…also if they kept Osama on ice as some claim how did they know ten years later who would be president and why wait ten years…why trot him out now?

  92. Holy Sinner…

    I don’t know if you or anyone else has seen the interview of Obama talking about the raid. He gave on interview only. Here it is in full:

  93. Holy Sinner…

    How do you know it was taken down by anti aircraft fire? Links?

    According to Obama the aircraft crashed due to it’s hovering capabilities being compromised by the walls around the compound (updraft issues)…the report above talks about that. They then destroyed it beyond that.

  94. Oby,
    This is why I asked you to listen to that interview. It has the exact answer – not from a Muslim or a Pakistani, Arab – but an American who is working in the gov. He is asked the same questions you are asking me. He knows better. Why don’t take the time and listen to it and there are mind blowing stuff in that.

  95. Sarah, I couldn’t watch that whole video. Something about it just made me want to rip my own face off! LOL Seriously. It took forever to seem to get anywhere and it was over the TOP cheesy with all it’s fake exciting news desk features etc. Could you perhaps save us some torture and tell us exactly at what point in the video this interview is?

  96. I mean direct us to the ‘mind blowing stuff’. Thanks

  97. No way Bush would have left office with OBL still on ice. It would in no way have served his interest.

  98. Sandy, I agree completely.

  99. @Sarah,
    When did a non-Muslim American working for government become the acceptable authority for truth for you? It seems more you decide what you want to have happened and then find someone to support it.

  100. Lynn,
    I know that the first part of the videos is a bit boring,especially in the beginning. You can start with the second part where it starts getting interesting and faster.

    I usually make my own judgement and don’t agree with somethng just because I like that opinion. I wish, believe me, I wish I am wrong but everytime I look at deeper, the more I am convinced that what I think its very possible. I tend to accept what the doc says because he worked for the gov for a very long time under 3 presidents, still working, he did good works with hostages, he does not agree with people decieving others and his words are very convincing as he gives clear reasons, and there are other things that makes you lean towards what he is saying, There is something that just tells you deep inside, intuition or whatever yo call it, that guides to think this way or that.

    You ask when did a non-Muslim … become acceptabple authority to me. I ask when did one not? What does it mean anyway? Are you saying just because one is non-muslims or American, he must be wrong in my opinion? It does not matter if they are non muslim or American or Congolese. One who is in authority must not deceive the public.

  101. Sarah,

    When you get some time you should look up the principle of ockham’s razor. I think you can benefit greatly by applying it when dealing with opposing explanations of events.


  102. @sarah – i watched the video and i didn’t get anything out of it.. you reallyy believed that !!!

    That’s ok to each his own. all i can say i believe Osama is dead ( when i don’t care)
    I also believed he was responsible for 9/11 ( especially since he claimed he did it)
    If it was not al-qaeda why on earth did they accept blame – just for fun ???

    so in my mind he’s gone , as for the helicopter theories by someone else.. how the heck would you know the capacity/volumen/range etc., of an helicopter that is just out unless you actually tested it yourself !!!!

    Even the folks who built it don’t know if it was loaded to capacity or not, BTW look up the internet and you will find 10 diff stats for that very same helicopter — you can actually pick and choose which suits your theory.

    so in effect i’m glad we are done with this and he’s gone, now i’m just waiting for the next demented wonderto emerge and start the massacre — given the current trend that’s not far off!! sigh!!!!

    As for a burial, I for one am glad they dumped him inthe ocean. and didn’t release the pictures.

    My only doubt is if he indeed dies in 2001 then who the heck is producing his offspring 🙂 his wives seem to be getting pregnant and producing his kids ( without him? how?)

  103. Radha, I did say that first video was a little boring but the follow ups to that video are interesting. And yes I do believe it. OBL did not say he is responsible for 911. In fact he said he did not do it. But after some time a fake video appeared saying that he did it. In that video “OBL” did not even look like OBL. So no he did not admit to it.

    To clear your doubt of offsprings. How do you know he reproduced all that. I know you work in a hospital but did you actually see his preggy wives and giving births? For all the stories going around, lol, if he is/was on ice, his sperms could have joined him, eh?! 🙂 Thats one theory.

  104. Sarah….

    About a week ago when Al Queda blew up two opperatives in the midst of the Pakistani army and said that they did it in revenge for Osama and as retribution for Pakistan being weak, who do you believe did that?

    When Al Queda came out and said on the jihadi websites that they are seeking retribution for his death, who did that?

    AND if he were dead 10 years ago WHY are many Muslims who found him to be a hero upset now. Don’t you think they would have mourned him 10 years ago? Or is the Middle East deluded as well?

  105. Oby, to be frank I only heard of some bombers who killed about 80 ppl in Pakistan. Is that what you are referring? I only heard about it and not sure who is responsible for that.

    But as I said Al Qaida is US invention. Where are the jihadi websites? Do you have the links? People can say anything on sites, right?

    Many people, like you, are not aware or are not sure of his death 10 years ago. And OBL is not a hero to all Muslims. It is only now that a President clearly announced his death and it is something like a closure and perhaps that is what people are mourning.

  106. InterFaith Dialogues In Full Swing, Especially After the Demise of OBL … At Big Mohammed’s House!!

  107. Gotta love John Oliver!! lol

  108. OMG! Laughed hysterically…thanks Harry. Needed a great laugh today!

  109. @sarah — “OBL did not say he is responsible for 911. In fact he said he did not do it. But after some time a fake video appeared saying that he did it. In that video “OBL” did not even look like OBL.”

    How do you know what Osama looks like and which is fake and which is real.. for all you know the first videa could be a fake and the 2nd real 🙂

    unless you live in close proximity to him i doubt you could tell.. but yes al-qaeda bantering about revenge kinda provs it for me, as well his son bleating about his dad’s burial !!!

  110. Radha, we have been seeing OBL in videos for a long time and then when you see suddenly a fatter one with both arms working and with fat nose and different mannerisms and way of talking, one comes to know that it is a fake one.

  111. @sarah – how does one come to know, i could send you 20 diff photoshopped photo’s of osama and there is no way you can pick the original true one !!! unless like i reiterate you are close to him and observe him.
    How would you know his mannerisms??? he is rarely in public and it’s not like he wanders around exhibiting mannerismsto aone and all !!!

    All i’m trying to show you is just as you think everyone is lying about osama and 9/11 there is the other half where everything is real.

    We can at best be armchair detectives, anyway back to the topic, he died , and if all said and done is true then one bad guy is gone..

    As for 80 people dead in pakistan, Al -qaeda again claimed responsibility ( or as per your logic, the US govt masqerading as al-qaeda sent it’s CIA to go blow themselves up) either way 80+ innocent people lost their lives int he name of al-qaeda, there are 80 families there grieving bereft of a loved one, thanks to the nameless, non-existant al-qaeda revenging their non-existant leader…

    If i were a muslim and if Osama was doing all this inthe name of my religion i’d want him hacked alive and fed to wild dogs !!! dumping him in the ocean is too tame . but hey that’s just me.

    you believe that “them” are doing all this, i prefer to give them a name.. lets leave it at that and beg to differ 🙂

  112. Radha, I agree. What is the point of killing OBL and still there are massacres going on in the name of Al Qaeda. So his death was really pointless.

  113. Radha, very nice rational comment.

  114. @sarah – thanks , yes massacres still ongoing is v v sad.

    but no his death was not pointless, It does make a point. “The world does not like murderers”. “murdering int he name of religion is bad ” , and people who do that meet a very bad end 🙂

    That’s the point.
    Also to those who lost loved ones directly or indirectly by him , this gives closure, we may all claim to be peace-loving and forgiving but in the end , if someomw hurts a loved one, human nature seeks retribution.

    In my mind killing Osama is justified ( right or wrong) , he was a bad man and deserved it. infact in my personal opinion, he dies easy , i much prefer the method i stated in my last comment 🙂

  115. thanks Aafke . hope you are doing well 🙂

  116. Radha, *i much prefer the method i stated in my last comment*


    Yeah, thanks I am ok.

  117. A majority of Pakistanis surveyed in a poll appeared to be aggrieved over the death of Osama bin Laden, with 51 per cent describing their emotions as “grief” though one-third said they were unconcerned by the incident.

    Yet in America media report after media report showed Muslim spokesmen expressing joy and relief that Osama was dead. Can someone explain, please, how Islam in America differs from Islam in Pakistan, such that the reaction to Osama’s death among Muslims in both places is so different?

    Do they have a different koran? A different Mohammad? Or could it be that the two groups of Muslims actually agree on this question more than they might wish to admit to pollsters or journalists?

    “Most Pakistanis grieve for Osama”, from Rediff News:

  118. You know what I said when I heard the news? “Allahu Akbar!” Even 9-11 aside he was a mass-murderer of Muslim and non-Muslim alike.

    @Harry alot of the discrepancy is that MANY Muslims simply refuse to believe he did it. He was ‘framed’ etc. etc. and blah blah blah. He’s trying to help Palestinians etc. etc. (though no one has been able to tell me one thing that has benefitted the Palestinians from all this)

  119. I just had to post this for Sarah and the HOLY SINNER….

    More fuel for their interpretation of things…however, I am thinking if America was full of crap they would not be having conflicting stories as they attempt to get the story out. There would be no confusion or contradiction. They would have had the “official” story down pat and everyone would stick to that. Instead they are talking about mishaps and such…doesn’t sound to me like the words of people who are conspiracy makers. Sounds more like honesty to me. Perhaps a tad confused in the melee but honesty none the less. IMO.

  120. @Prayers for Osama at a Mass in Florida

    A Catholic church in Florida has created a controversy by accepting a prayer request for the soul of Osama bin Laden and publishing it in their parish bulletin.

    Interesting stuff. Should the Church have accepted the prayer request for Osama bin Laden?

    Watch the news/video by clicking on the link below:

  121. Sarah…

    Another collusion on the part of the USA?

    Notice he didn’t say our enemy is NATO and leave it at that as they are the ones occupying the land…(fight against the invaders) He went on to say Jews and Christians were the enemy too. People who have done nothing to him..

  122. Harry, I absolutely think that they should have accepted the prayer request it is very clear in the Christian scripture that you should love and pray for your enemies. I think if one is a true believer then it would be a no brainer and it should be up to the pastor or priest as their religious leader to make it clear why it should be done. Whether or not ‘God’ would accept those prayers would be another issue and not one that they should be considering.

  123. oooooooo…..

    Harry that is such a thorny question…and would assuredly test the most strident Christian’s faith. However, as Christians we believe that there is hope for one’s soul even until the end. A very dogmatic Christan might say he is going to hell anyway for not believing in Jesus as his savior. But I do think that although it would be very very difficult and some people might just burst into flames at the thought, praying for Osama would be in line with Christian doctrine…as Lynn said, beyond that it is up to God to decide what to do with him…

  124. Having said that however…I will out myself…I am not that good of a Christian as I have not said a single prayer on his behalf…I figure there are enough Osama fans doing the deed.

  125. Oby, do you pray The Lord’s Prayer? Doesn’t that cover it? Or do you have to mention each trespasser individually? 🙂

    I myself am not into forgiveness so much so I would have a hard time being a Christian. 😉

    My personal ‘prayer’ goes more like this:

    Grant me the patience to accept that which cannot be changed, the courage to change that which I cannot accept, and the wisdom to know where to hide the bodies of those that piss me off!

  126. Lynn…

    I LOVE your prayer..feels so much more satisfying!!!

  127. Interim Leader of al Qaeda Named

    Just heard it on CNN: Al-Qaeda’s Department of Human Resources and High Explosives reportedly names acting leader. An Egyptian who was once a Special Forces officer has been chosen “caretaker” leader of al Qaeda in the wake of Osama bin Laden’s death, according to a source with detailed knowledge of the group’s inner workings.

  128. Here’s a video from Discovery Channel, which gives a simulated look at how US Navy Seals killed bin Laden …. step by step. The video has lot of commercial breaks but otherwise is quite informative ….

  129. […] 2011: Reaction to the Death of Usama bin Laden was the most popular post in May with 128 […]

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