Saudi Arabia: Do Christians and Muslims Worship the Same God?

Christians and Muslims both worship God.  Allah is the Arabic word for God.

Muslims recognize Jesus Christ as a Prophet (pbuh).

Christians recognize Muhammed as a Prophet (pbuh).

However, Christians also recognize Jesus as the Son of God and as God.  Most Muslims do not.  Furthermore, Christians believe in the trinity which is The Father (God), The Son (Jesus Christ) and the Holy Spirit (essence of God).

In the simplest of terms, Christians believe that the Trinity is three in one such as God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

So while it is clear that both Christians and Muslims believe in a higher being called God, do they in fact worship the same God?

Will Muslims and Christians share the same heaven?

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77 Responses

  1. The Muslim and Christian concepts of God are so different that they might as well be worshipping different Gods. The God of the Muslims most resembles the jealous and angry God of the old Testament. The God that the Christians worship mostly reflects the character of Jesus (who we often think of as loving but when I go back and read the New Testament he can also sound a bit evasive). When I have read the Koran the voice of Allah sounds both angry and boastful (a bit like the character of the Wizard of Oz in the movie). I have read accounts from English readers of Arabic that says the tone is more sad than angry in Arabic, but I have no way of knowing for sure. Still the way Arabs seem to think of their God is so completely different than that of Christians. The characters both come from middle eastern myths but the results are very different.

  2. The God of the Bible and the God of Islam are make believe and guarded by people who believe in fairytales, they can be call demi-gods (mankind). So yes, they are the same since it boils down to mankind’s belief in a make believe story enforced by indoctrination, cultural oppression and their beneficiaries (typical the authoritarian figure(s) aka: dictator(s)).

  3. Jerry, I’m curious. In what ways does Jesus seem evasive to you? I like hearing other people’s impressions…if you don’t mind sharing.

    ———————————

    I think different religions have different views of God. Jews don’t think of God in the same way Christians do and Muslims have a different idea as well. And those are three Abrahamic religions. Mormons also have a different way of understanding God. Maybe we all are wrong. I did learn that Mormons don’t believe in hell so we are all guaranteed at least the lowest level of heaven! I hope they are right!

  4. That was my point of confusion as long as I was Muslim. We believe almost the same things, so why would we have conflict? I think the etiology of part of the animosity is what happened to start the cruisades, when the Ottoman Turks closed off access to the Christian holy city. Now the causation may be deeper than that, so I do not claim to know everything.

    And, oddly the people at my church are not offended when I wear an abaya, or even a Hijab. Both seem troubled by the fact that I tell them that I accepted Muhammad PBUH and the Holy Qur’an, so when it came to Joseph Smith and the BOM, there was no real issue. I was just baptised Mormon on the 29th.

    I can not understand why some Muslims are so bent on hating Christians and visa versa. I think that this does not please Allah SWT at all.

    And Susanne, Mormons do believe in hell, but only for the worst of the worst. One of my life goals is to see Muslims and Christians loving each other.

  5. Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, I do remember their saying hell is for about “six people” – like Judas and whoever else is considered the worst ones.

  6. @susanne430

    ”I did learn that Mormons don’t believe in hell so we are all guaranteed at least the lowest level of heaven! I hope they are right!”

    What about you? Do you believe muslims like me will go to hell?

  7. susanne430,

    One example is where Jesus is asked about taxation and gives an answer capable of multiple interpretations (.. render unto Caesar …). I certainly understand the need to careful when he answered questions. There are other parts of the New Testament that I think are artifacts of later generations trying to make Jesus proclaim him self the literal son of God. Most of what Jesus says I wouldn’t find problematic, for examples, I don’t find his parables evasive.

    I was raised Christian (Catholic actually), so I am used to thinking quite positively about Jesus. I have tried as I get older to be more objective. If I am critical of people like Mohammed I need to be as critical of Jesus.

  8. Susanne:

    Speaking of Judas. How do you see the gospels of Judas where Judas was instructed by Jesus to turn him over and that he was the best of the apostles? This is Gnostic but still Christianity.
    Then there is all of the gospels fournd at Nag Hammadi that shed a different light on Christianity beginnings that actually turned the serpent into the hero and the God of the Bible into the deceiver. That is a whole different spin on Christianity. Any thoughts?

  9. suzanne430

    Jesus was a product of his time. So when he describes how outsiders can be virtuous, he doesn’t pick a true outsider but a Samaritan. Imagine if Jesus had a sermon about the good Roman, now that would have been even better, but he had to preach to the people of his community who could not have accepted Romans being described as virtuous. One of the reasons why I cannot accept the the idea that any scripture is divine is that it is so obviously part of the culture it came from.

  10. Jerry, you think by making a Samaritan the hero it was somehow easier for a Jewish person to swallow? I’ve always heard the two sides hated each other. The Samaritan woman even questioned why Jesus – a Jew – would speak to her. But maybe that’s because men didn’t always speak to women back then…hmm.

    Jesus did marvel at the faith of a centurion, didn’t he? The Gospels record him as being amazed to find such faith that he could not find amongst the Israelites.

    And I’ve heard the go the extra mile thing explained as being nice to the hated Romans (which would have shocked his audience).

    By the way, thanks for sharing your point of view. I enjoyed that. And, yes, I can see why you feel you must be equally critical of Jesus in order to be fair.

  11. bigstick, I have a friend who has argued that Judas’ betrayal was a job…I’ve always found that rather interesting really. It’s not something I’ve grown up hearing.

  12. Snowman, like I said, I hope there is no hell. Universal salvation sounds good to me!

    What do you believe? I’ve known Muslims on both sides.

  13. Snowman:
    Your’r gonna be really surprised. Most of the stuff you see on youtube on evil Mormons, just is not true. Mormons do not attack anyone. That is what attracted me to them. Muslims attack everyone, well some of them.

  14. Gwen,

    Unlike most people, I do know Mormons quite well. I was raised in Arizona in a very Mormonish area (near Mesa, dahhhh). About half of the neighbors were LDS.

    My impressions:
    1. Smart, good people.
    2. Good food
    3. Clanish to the extreme, not very sociable outside their group. Often their kids did not play with us because we were ‘gentiles’ (yeah, as if they are jews…).
    4. Crazy underwear
    5. Very controlling. The Bishop and Stake want to know all about you, down to the last and most intimate details (not just financial).
    6. A very crazy theology and history. If you think Muslims have problems, try to ask a Mormon about the basics and history of their church.

    In short, a great social club and safety net (they take care of their own) but not much OK for anti-social or libertarian types like myself.

    Do you know what a “jack Mormon’ is? It is an old term my dad often used.

    jay

  15. susanne430

    I am not as much critical of Jesus as trying to be more objective. It is impossible to live in this culture and not be swamped by positive images of Jesus. So, I try to be the devils advocate in a small way. I am biased in a negative way towards Mohammed and I try to be more neutral (very hard for me). The Muslims have made Mohammed into something like a demi-god. They will not admit this but it is true. When Muslims says they are monotheists (and that is an idea that is not as wonderful as they think), they seem to forget the duet of Allah and his perfect prophet.

  16. About not attacking anyone… tell that to the people at Mountain Meadows.

    But that was long ago. Today the LDS are pretty main stream except for the fundies up in Shortcreek.

    There is a good and somewhat funny story about the MM massacre, about the ceremony intended to put old ghosts to rest and clean the slate. About 15 years ago (?), the LDS church decided to OK a monument to the dead, recognizing their role in the sad story. It was always an embarrassment to the elders but they decided that if they approved a small monument and bronze plate with a few words, the issue would be put to rest. Now MM is a large area, many acres in extension. Anyway, church and state officials, as well as descendents of the dead pioneers gathered to have a quick, simple ceremony. They picked a spot at random and got out the shovels for the symbolic ground-turning. Of course, the first shovel turned up bones and the rest is history. Talk about bad luck. The called in the forensic folks to dig up the home area and so instead of a simple 1 hour event it became a story carried for weeks. The MM trial was the big event of the 19 century in post-civil war America. Old Lee took the blame and B. Young escaped without charges. By the way, it was a Mormon lady, a writer, that was responsible for the Church coming to terms with its sins.

  17. it was something i always wondered too…

    if Jesus needed to be killed in order for salvation to happen and Judas was responsible for Jesus being killed, then wasn’t Judas doing the right thing turning him in? if Judas didn’t turn him in, then there would have been no crucifixion (at least not the same sequence of events).

    so why is Judas always given the worst of the worst punishment?

    is there any church decision on this or anything? I never knew

    ———————————–

    Yes I believe we worship the same God.
    What I have come to understand as the “reason” for God needing to be in three parts is that we cannot understand Him as just One. He is beyond our comprehension. (At least this is what I have been told. There may be other reasons that no one has brought to my attention.) However, I think a Muslim would not ever split God into pieces since they are able to understand God as only One.

    To me, this is the main difference and it is not a difference of the essence of God but of man’s ability to understand His nature.

  18. NeverEver:

    Try finding the Gospel of Judas. It sheds a different light on that history. However if you go back far enough you will even find that archeologist and historians don’t believe the exodus ever occurred. There is no historical evidence and according to archeologist nothing was ever noted in Egypt for that time period for this event. Go back even further and find out how Yahweh was developed from a pagan god. So what is real in these books and what is not? So much contradiction, so many different stories, so many lost books. So many different versions. All of it points to one thing. Fiction.

  19. @bigstick

    I certainly agree with you there. The Jewish myths are no better or worse than those of any other middle eastern culture. They may have value as myth but not as history.

  20. Jay:
    Jack Mormon has two meanings, depending on the era. First it mean people who were not baptised but otherwise friendly, even attending services.

    In the early 20th century, it came to mean a back slid-den or inactive Mormon.

    I’m a very analytic, investigative person, I’ve read a lot of lies about Muslims, and later read a lot of lies about Mormons. Why do people tell such whoppers about others? I can’t say.

    I have a past; one with mistakes that I am not proud of. Surah 49 says we are not to look into the past, and backbite others. Islam also says that once we ask Allah SWT for forgiveness, our past is done, not to be spoken of any more.. Muslims would be good to practice their own religion in humility and repentance.

    The LDS say that the Atonement means that our sins are gone and forgotten and they practice that. That’s the difference for me between Islam and the LDS.

  21. Since when do christians recognise muhammed as a Prophet? Big Lie, he is a false prophet!

  22. if you ask any muslim, they will not say that jesus is a god or a son of god. Jesus is one of the prophets muslims believe in. jesus was a miracle to his mother maryam(mary), allah gave her a baby although she was a virgin and never been touched by a man. hope this explains part of your questions:)

    I think the question of heaven is interesting:)

  23. Judas is an interesting figure who I think in some ways got a bad rap. There has been discovery of the “Gospel of Judas” recently which indicates that Judas was actually considered Jesus’ favored one…who understood his mission and teachings at a level greater and deeper than the other apostles. In the bible he is a traitor…yet according to the newest Gospel he did Jesus’ bidding at Jesus’ request BECAUSE he was the most trusted by Jesus…very interesting.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_Judas

  24. It would bereally chaotic if there were more than one heaven. I can imagine people scrambling ot get int he right line to make it into THE correct heaven 🙂

    and what then they have fences separating them??? do we get to go across and meet freinds residing in another religions heaven ??

    I think there’s one heaven , for all people for all religions, no matter what. we’ll all be there and wonder why on earth we were so polarised and fighting about silly things like religion, my god Vs your god and my book vs your book etc., on earth..

  25. I highly reccommed Deepak Chopra’s ‘The Third Jesus’. Fascinating read.

  26. All “gods” ….. muslim or christian or jewish or buddhist or hindu … are all one and the same. It is instructive to read “A History of God” by Karen Armstrong in which she supplies irrefutable evidence that the concept of monotheism evolved with the jewish faith from the syncretism of various polytheistic sources like Canaanite and Babylonian polytheism.

    It is also instructive to watch this video:

  27. in Islam we believe is the Christianity is religion with god book like Muslim has
    but the different is the relation between god (who create everything) and slave ( human must fallow the god orders ) which come by using messengers (who get some kind of contact to god )

  28. Humans had to have an explanation for being here so they had to have God, a being who made everything. Thinking along that vein to my mind God would be the same for all religions/people who believe in a supreme being. Humans don’t like to think that when they die it is the end so there is a Heaven. In my mind that heaven would be whatever a person wants it to be.

  29. There is only one God. He speaks to us through His prophets. Each time some of the people listen and others reject the prophet. The Jews rejected Jesus. The Christians rejected Muhammad. Now we have The Revelation of Arès, received by Michel Potay directly from Jesus and God speaking through a stick of light. It says Muhammad is His prophet. Religion does not have the truth, there are so many of them, which one would be the right one? They all make stuff up. Our Creator does not tell us to join a religion; He says for us to change, to be and do Good.

  30. @ All
    I have read the comments. It is very interesting.No one seems to be religious.But they talk about “GOD”, “god”, Judas”, “Gospel” “Jesus”,Creator”, Holy spirit”. But they have no name.
    Muslims worship only one GOD and His name is ALLAH. No pressure on any one to believe such.
    Radhaa of 7 Feb————–All will be there. Ofcourse but for results. Be carefull, what happens who fail.

  31. Sami, what you do mean “but they have no name”? I think Judas and Jesus are much more specific names than “God.” God can be Elohim, Zeus, Jupiter, Allah, Yahweh, Apollo and so forth. Even Allah is “the God” .. it’s not like your God’s name is very specific unless his first name is “the.”

  32. Christians do not believe Muhammad is a prophet. If Muslims spent time thinking about it they could not really accept Jesus as a prophet either without acknowledging that he is really the son of God. Prophets are messengers from God. God would not send 2 prophets that have conflicting messages, it just doesn’t work that way. Muhammad can’t come in on the scene some 600 years after Jesus died on the cross and say, “by the way salvation that Jesus came for was made up. God changed his mind and there is a new way.” God does not change his mind like people do. Muslims have to accept him for a fake or the real deal.

  33. Very intersting topic. I believe that Muslims and Christians pray to the God, although the big difference is the concept of Jesus. However, there are also many teachings that are similar:kindness, kindness for the poor, social injustice, importance of prayer, helping out your neighbor. Unfortunately, there seems to be more on an emphasis on differences, and who is going to hell…Some christians believe that if you do not believe that Jesus is your savior then you go to hell, and some Muslims believe that if you do not accept Islam then you are going to hell. Notice I said some not all. One question, I don’t remember any Christian being taught that Muhammad (PBUH) is a prophet…I was raised Catholic, and I never learned about Muhammad (PBUH)…are there any Christians religions out there that believe that Muhammad (PBUH) is a prophet?

  34. “Other religions, even the ones which claim belief in “One God”, people often approach God through an intermediary, such as a saint, an angel, the Virgin Mary or Jesus. However, it is only in Islam that a person is required only to pray to God.”

    Uniqueness of the Name

    The name for the religion of Islam is much more than just a name because it expresses a deep spiritual meaning as well as an overall outlook on life and concept of worship. The word “Islam” is an Arabic word which means “complete submission to the will of Almighty God”. Other religions are named after their founders, such as Christianity and Buddhism; after a tribe or ethnic group, such as Judaism; or after a specific geographical region, such as Hinduism. Islam, however, is unique because its name represents its outlook on life and reflects its universal nature. Additionally, the name “Islam” was not thought up by its followers or applied by other people, as is the case with the names of other religions, but was revealed by Almighty God. This name expressed nothing new, because submission to the will of God, i.e. “Islam”, has always been the true religion of God. Due to this fact, and since the teachings of Islam are straightforward, profound and logical, Islam is the “Natural Religion” of all human beings. The name of no other religion carries any significant message, or conveys the true sense of its outlook on life, as does the name “Islam”.

    Universality & Continuity of the Message

    The command to worship none other than Almighty God and to submit to His will has been revealed by God to all of His prophets throughout mankind’s long history. The pure essence of the beliefs and teachings that were revealed by God to the Prophet Muhammad are the same as God taught to Abraham, who was one of the earliest and greatest prophets. So actually, Muhammad is the final prophet of Islam — not the first. Additionally, Islam is the true “religion of Abraham”, because Abraham completely submitted himself to the revealed will of Almighty God. Islam is truly unique among the religions of the world because it is addressed to all of mankind. The scripture of Islam, called the Qur’an, repeatedly addresses all human beings by saying: “O mankind!” Additionally, in the Qur’an, Almighty God is never addressed as the God of a particular people or nation. From the very beginning of the mission of Prophet Muhammad, his followers came from a wide spectrum of individuals — there was Bilal, the African slave; Suhaib, the Byzantine Roman; Ibn Sailam, the Jewish Rabbi; and Salman, the Persian. Since religious truth is eternal and unchanging, and mankind is one universal brotherhood, God’s revelations to man have always been consistent and universal. Submission to the will of God, and worshipping Him alone without intermediaries, has always been the only religion acceptable to Almighty God.

    A Straightforward Concept of God

    Unique among the religions of the world, the concept of God in Islam is completely based upon Divine Revelation. Not only is the concept of God in Islam characterized by purity and clarity, but it is also not marred by myths, superstitions or man-made philosophical ideas. In the pure and straightforward teachings of Islam, Almighty God has clearly revealed His unique nature and qualities to man in the way which He wants them to be understood. While other religions have either mixed man-made doctrines with divine revelation, or ignored the divine revelation almost completely, Islam’s concept of God is based totally on what God has said about Himself. Islam’s concept of God can be called pure and straightforward because there is a clear distinction made between the Creator and the created. As such, there is no ambiguity in divinity — it is made clear that there is nothing divine or worthy of being worshipped except for Almighty God. In Islam, calling someone other than Almighty God “Lord” or “Savior” is completely prohibited because such terms compromise God’s uniqueness and because all of our trust should be put in Almighty God — who is the Most Merciful and the Controller of all affairs. The only Creator — Almighty God — is Unique, Eternal and Transcendent above His Creation. Everything else besides Almighty God — meaning anything that you can see or even imagine — is part of God’s creation, and thus not worthy of worship. Almighty God, as He has described Himself in the Qur’an, is Absolutely One and “the Most Merciful of those who show mercy”. Even though God is transcendent above His creation, due to His infinite Mercy He is constantly involved with the affairs of His creatures. Even though God is infinite, unique and incomprehensible, in the Holy Qur’an He has revealed Himself in a way suitable to the finite and limited human mind. By reaching out to man and sending revelations through all of His prophets, God has allowed Himself to be known through His unique and most-beautiful attributes. Because the concept of God in Islam was sent by God specifically for mankind, it appeals to the innate nature of the human being. Due to this fact, Islam does not ask man to accept irrational, ludicrous or man-made doctrines about God. The Islamic concept of God strikes a unique balance between various religions an because is avoids reducing God to just being some remote and impersonal “First Cause” or “Higher Power”, while on the other hand it also teaches that a direct and personal relationship with God can be maintained without believing God to be like His creation or incarnate in it.

    Direct Relationship with God

    In other religions, even the ones which claim belief in “One God”, people often approach God through an intermediary, such as a saint, an angel, the Virgin Mary or Jesus. However, it is only in Islam that a person is required only to pray to God. Some people also nullify a truly proper and direct relationship with Almighty God by mistakenly believing that they have a special relationship with Him simply because they are members of a certain ethnic group, tribe or “chosen people”. Additionally, in Islam there are no priests or clergy — each worshipper, man or woman, has a direct relationship with their Merciful Creator — Almighty God. Since God is the Owner and Sustainer of everything, as well as the only one who can provide true and complete forgiveness, it is completely futile to try to approach Him through anyone else. According to the teachings of Islam, praying to or worshipping anything or anyone besides Almighty God is the greatest sin a person can commit. Even though other religions believe in God, they nullify this belief by making the grave mistake of not always approaching Him directly. Some religions even go so far as to say that human beings, due to their sinfulness, cannot approach God without an intermediary — which mistakenly implies that God is unable or unwilling to forgive human-beings directly. Islam teaches that Almighty God has the power to do all things and that no one should ever despair of His mercy. According to the teachings of Islam, God is always ready to bestow His abundant Grace and Mercy on anyone who turns to Him in repentance. Even people who used to commit the worst sin of worshipping others besides God will be forgiven if they realize what they are doing is wrong and repent. Having a direct relationship with God, and understanding that He alone deserves worship and praise, goes hand-in-hand with the Islamic concept of God. This is because once a proper concept of God is established in the heart and mind, submission to God and complete reliance on Him alone comes naturally.

    Unique Concept of Worship

    According to the teachings of Islam, everything that a human being does with the pure intention of pleasing God is an act of worship. Due to this, Islam has an all encompassing concept of worship unlike any other religion. Almighty God has revealed in the Noble Qur’an that His purpose for creating human beings was to worship Him and Him alone. Like other religions, Islam has required acts of worship, however worship in Islam is not limited to rituals. Since Islam is an all-encompassing religion with guidance for all aspects of life, almost every action in a Muslim’s life becomes an act of worship if it is done to build a better relationship with God. Since man’s purpose in life is to worship and submit to God, worship in Islam has been defined by God Himself in an all-encompassing way. This special uniqueness can also be seen in the fact that most other religions only require formal worship once per week, while Islam requires it five times a day. Even more importantly, all rites of formal worship in Islam are based on Divine revelation, while the modes of worship in other religions are a mixture of Divine revelation, man-made traditions, opinions of clergymen and religious councils. Additionally, in Islam acts of worship such as prayer and fasting have been described by God and His Prophet in such detail that it gives human beings a feeling of assurance that the way they are worshipping God is pleasing to Him.

    Based on Authentic Sources

    The preservation of the scripture of Islam — the Noble Qur’an — is unique among world religions. No other religion has a scripture which is both as old and as well-preserved as the one possessed by Muslims today. Even scholars who are hostile to Islam admit that the Qur’an that exists today is exactly the same as the one that existed in the time of the Prophet Muhammad. Even though many people mistakenly assume that the Qur’an (also spelled Koran) was written by Muhammad, it is actually the literal Word of God. Not only was Muhammad known by his people to be unable to read and write, but the Noble Qur’an clearly and repeatedly exclaims that it is from Almighty God – the Lord of the Universe. Unlike other religions, the followers of Islam have always considered their scripture to be the Word of God in toto. The scriptures of other religions are made up of writings that were not considered to be scripture until many years after they were written – the letters of (St.) Paul are a good example of this. Additionally, the Noble Qur’an has always been in the possession of the common believer, and as such was circulated very widely. In this way, Muslims know that their scripture is authentic, unlike other so-called “scriptures” which are still claimed to be scripture even though their authors are unknown. The Qur’an also remained pure and authentic because unlike other scriptures, it was written down and memorized in the lifetime of the prophet that it was revealed to. Also, its wide circulation prevented scholars, clergy and religious councils from deciding what should and should not be part of the scripture — since it was already in the hands of the people in its complete form. It has always amazed people to find out that the entire Qur’an was not only memorized word-for-word by hundreds of the companions of Prophet Muhammad, but that it has been memorized verbatim by thousands upon thousands of people until this very day in its original language of Arabic. It was only natural for Almighty God to preserve the scripture revealed to Prophet Muhammad, because he was the last Prophet and Final Messenger of God. In short, the Qu’ran is a unique scripture that has come down to us in its original form and unique language. Due to its pristine teachings and unquestionable authenticity, the Qur’an removes the need for man to wonder for himself how to worship and please God, since God Himself has clearly described these things.

    An Eternal Message

    Islam has just as much meaning and is just as applicable to people living in today’s “modern world” as it did for people living 1400 years ago. Since the message of Islam is eternally true it is also very robust, and as such still has a strong spiritual impact on millions of people living in the world today. The Pure Monotheism of Islam, as well as its universal brotherhood/sisterhood, strong morals and positive outlook on life, is still very relevant and meaningful to modern societies. The continued relevance and applicability to both the spiritual and worldly life of human beings from all around the word is just one of the many proofs of the Divine origin of the message of Islam. Unlike the teachings of other religions, the teachings of Islam don’t need to be updated or watered-down in order to appeal to a human being living in today’s troubled world. Since the teachings of Islam are both spiritually true and eternally practical, they can be lived and implemented in the daily life of a person in order to make their life more fulfilling. In short, unique among world religions, Islam has not had to sacrifice its integrity in order to be both applicable to “modern life” and to have enough spiritual impact to change people’s lives.

    A Complete Way of Life

    Islam not just a “religion” in the traditional sense, because it is not just confined to acts of worship, morality and other aspects of personal piety. The teachings of Islam, even though they do cover religious rituals and morality, also encompass all other aspects of life. The Prophet Muhammad’s mission encompassed not only spiritual and religious teachings, but also included guidance for such things as social reform, economics, politics, warfare and family life. Thus due to the diversity and success of Muhammad’s mission, Muslims have clear guidance from God and His Final Prophet on all aspects of life. This goes hand-in-hand with the Islamic belief that Almighty God does not leave human beings without guidance in their daily lives — thus His guidance is all-encompassing. Due to God’s wisdom, and because Islam is the final revealed religion, the guidance that God has sent is applicable for all times and for all places. This can be seen in the fact that the guidance for some aspects of life is much more broad and flexible than others. Additionally, in the Qur’an, Almighty God has revealed to mankind that the purpose of our creation is to worship and remember God in all aspects of our life, and to follow His guidance in everything that we do. Thus Islam does not accept a secular view of government and society, but only one based on the Law of God. Nor does Islam leave it to human beings to decide what is right and wrong, good and bad, moral and immoral based on their whims, desires or man-made idea. In short, Islam does not teach people to “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s” because, according to Islam, everything belongs to God. Like all of its other teachings, Islam’s view of other religions is balanced, realistic and moderate. Islam doesn’t view other religions as being either completely true nor completely false, but believes that all true religions were at one time divinely revealed. However, over time the teachings of the various religions, due to a variety of reasons, have become distorted and mixed with made-man ideas. But nonetheless, Muslims are required to be tolerant of other revealed religions since the Qur’an clearly says: “Let there be no compulsion in religion”.

    Moderation

    The teachings of Islam, since they are divinely revealed, are balanced in all of their aspects. Even though Islam is an all-encompassing way of life, it preaches moderation and rejects extremism. On the one hand, Islam does not preach complete rejection of all worldly pleasures in view of the life hereafter; and on the other hand it does not teach that earthly life is just for pleasure and enjoyment. In Islam, wealth and worldly pleasures can be partaken of in this life as long as they are enjoyed in a way that is in obedience to God. However, Muslims are taught to keep in mind that the life hereafter is their ultimate goal, and therefore one should be charitable and not become too attached to worldly things. By maintaining a balance between man’s spiritual and physical needs, the teachings of Islam are best suited for the needs of human beings in particular and society in general. Since Islam is based on clear guidance from God, it rejects all man-made religious excesses, such as certain forms of monasticism where people try to completely “reject the world” and other forms of extreme self-denial. Islam teaches that human beings have responsibilities at all levels — to other individuals, to their families and to society as a whole. By maintaining a unique balance between the physical and spiritual, and between the individual and society, Islam maintains a balance in all directions.

    A Positive Outlook

    Most people will agree that having a strong self-esteem and a positive outlook on life is conducive to achieving happiness and success. Unique among the religions of the world, Islam’s view of both the nature of the human being and the purpose of life are extremely positive. Islam’s view of the nature of the human being is balanced. On the one hand they are not viewed as being inherently evil, but on the other they are not considered to be perfect – nor are they expected to be so. According to the teachings of Islam, every human being, man or woman, is born with a clean slate and is equally capable of both good and evil. Since God has bestowed limited free-will on human beings, they will ultimately be held responsible for their actions. Believing that “salvation” is based on “faith alone” reduces human life to a near meaningless and fatalistic existence. The teachings of Islam make it clear that human beings, since their nature is basically good, are capable of positive action in this life, and that the best way to achieve a balanced, happy and fulfilled life is complete submission to Almighty God. Certainly, no person can completely submit to God by simply wanting to do so, but by first realizing that none has a right to be worshipped and obeyed except for Almighty God, and then making a reasonable effort to follow God’s commands, all human beings can fulfill their reason for existence – which is to worship God alone. . The Noble Qur’an tells us that “man was created weak” and thus falls into sin often. On the other hand, man is not to think of himself as so evil and corrupt so as to despair of God’s mercy. As a recourse to this, and since Islam condemns self-righteousness, a pious life can only be lived by trusting in God — since there is no power or strength except through God. As such, spiritual felicity is achieved by a combination of both faith and action. As such, the most righteous person is not one who thinks that repentance is unnecessary, but the one who admits and realizes his mistakes – and then repents. According to the word of Almighty God as revealed in the Holy Qur’an, mankind is God’s trustee on earth; and as such the life of this world is a test, not a punishment. Even before God created the first man, He knew that he would sin, however God created man in spite of this. According to the Qur’an, God has bestowed on human beings a great trust and given them dignity. It is only by worshipping Almighty God, directly and without intermediaries, that a human being can fulfull their true innate nature and purpose of existence. In short, Islam is realistic. It portrays human beings just as they are and the life of the world just as it is. Since the outlook of Islam is divinely revealed is not based on wishful or negative thinking, but simply on reality. Islam also has a positive view of mankind in general, since it teaches that the best person in the sight of God is the one who is most God-conscious. In this way the truth of Islam and the universality of God’s message transcends all of the barriers of race, nationality, ethnic group and economic status.

  35. And behold! God will say: “O Jesus the son of Mary! Did you say unto men, ‘worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of God?'” He will say: “Glory to you. Never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, You would indeed have known it. You know what is in my heart, though I know not what is in Yours. For you know in full what is hidden. (The Noble Qur’an 5:116)

    Why is Jesus GOD?

    1. Jesus Is God Because He Claimed To Be The Son Of God

    2. Jesus Is God Because He Is God’s Only Begotten Son

    3. Jesus Is God Because He Was Born Without A Human Father

    4. Jesus Is God Because He Called God The Father

    5. Jesus Is God Because He Is Called Messiah

    6. Jesus is GOD Because He Received Worship

    7. Jesus is GOD Because He is called Lord and God

    8. Jesus is GOD Because He Pre-Existed

    9. Jesus is GOD Because He claimed Before Abraham Was I am

    10. Jesus is GOD Because He had the Power To Forgive Sins

    11. Jesus is GOD Because He is the way, the truth and the life

    12. Jesus is GOD Because He claims that I And The Father Are One

    13. Jesus is GOD Because He Possessed Knowledge of All Things

    14. Jesus is GOD Because He Performed Miracles

    15. Jesus never claimed to be GOD

    “Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, A MAN attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs which God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know…” Acts 2:22

    For the Christian, the only documents accepted as reporting the words of Jesus are the accounts given in the Bible. However, there are no sayings of Jesus where he claimed “I am God” or “Worship me”.

    All quotations used to prove that Jesus is divine are implicit, that is, they require interpretation. We are told what Jesus said and then told what he meant.

    The primary issue here is not whether Jesus is God, but whether he said that he was equal to God.

    The evidence that is presented by the Christian is either inadequate, inconclusive, ambiguous; or unacceptable.

    1. Jesus Is God Because He Claimed To Be The Son Of God

    In the language of the Hebrew Bible, righteous persons who follow the Will and Plan of God are know as Sons Of God.

    “Adam, which was the Son Of God.” Luke 3:38

    “The Sons Of God saw the daughters of men… And the Sons Of God came in unto the daughters of men…” Genesis 6: 2,4.

    “Israel is My Son, even my first born.” Exodus 4:22

    “…for I (God) am a Father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.” Jeremiah 31:9

    “The Lord hath said unto me (David), Thou art My Son this day have I Begotten thee.” Psalms 2:7.

    Also Mat 5:9; Romans 8:14 etc.

    Son Of God is a nothing but a metaphorical description commonly used among the Jews.

    2. Jesus Is God Because He Is God’s Only Begotten Son

    The most widely translated sentence on earth is said to be Jesus’ statement of John 3:16,

    “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son…”

    Christians wish to say that the word Only Begotten (Monogenis) gives Jesus a special status among all the Sons of God.

    However, not all Bibles translate the passage with this key word because some translators have seen the difficulty this causes.

    The same word translated as Only Begotten is found at Hebrews 11:17. In this verse the word refers to Isaac. The Bible itself shows that Isaac’s older brother Ishmael outlived his father (Genesis 25:9). Therefore, at no time was Isaac, strictly speaking, the only begotten of Abraham.

    In the case of Isaac the Church explains that “only-begotten” is not to be understood strictly but must be modified. However, no such modification is allowed in the case of John 3:16.

    3. Jesus Is God Because He Was Born Without A Human Father

    Does the miraculous birth of Jesus make him a God?

    If being born without a male parent entitles Jesus to being God, then Adam would have a greater right to such honor. Adam was born without either a human father or mother.

    4. Jesus Is God Because He Called God The Father

    The use of the term Father is inconclusive evidence that God was literally Father to Jesus. All Christians use the term when addressing God. The Jews themselves used the term (John 8:41). Jesus told them that the devil was their Father (John 8:44). Of course, he was not speaking literally.

    5. Jesus Is God Because He Is Called Messiah

    Muslims agree that Jesus was the Messiah. However, Christians have come to believe that there is a connotation of divinity in the word. Messiah is a Hebrew word meaning Anointed, its Grecian form is Christ. Although modern Bibles hide the fact, many individuals are called Messiah. Cyrus the Persian is called Messiah (anointed) in Isaiah 45:1.

    Where Bible verses refer to Jesus, translators prefer use the word Messiah or Christ. For all other occurrences, they render only the meaning of the word as anointed. In this way they hope to give the impression that there is only one Messiah. (for details see below)

    6. Jesus is GOD Because He Received Worship

    The fact that Jesus accepted worship is offered as strong proof of his divinity.

    John 9:38: “Lord, I believe, and he worshipped him.”

    Matthew 28:17 “they saw him, they worshipped him”.

    The word translated as worshipped in both verses is the Greek word proskuneo {pros-ku-neh’-o} which literally means: “To kiss, like a dog licking his masters hand”. (Strong’s concordance).

    Even Prophet Daniel was worshipped by Nebuchadnezzar:

    “Then the king Nebuchadnezzar fell upon his face and worshipped Daniel…” (Daniel 2:46, KJV)

    If He was not to be worshipped, why didn’t He tell this man to stop? It appears that “worship” was a type of greeting or salutation offered by the king.

    In all modern versions of the Bible, when Daniel was worshipped, the word worship has been removed. However, in the case of Jesus, the word worship still remains. (e.g., compare NIV and KJV)

    The same trick is applied to the word Messiah/Christ. Messiah is a Hebrew word meaning Anointed, its Grecian form is Christ. Although modern Bibles hide the fact, many individuals are called Messiah. Cyrus ther Persian is called Messiah (anointed) in Isaiah 45:1. Where Bible verses refer to Jesus, translators prefer use the word Messiah or Christ. For all other occurrences, they render only the meaning of the word as anointed. In this way they hope to give the impression that there is only one Messiah.)

    7. Jesus is GOD Because he is called Lord And God

    An episode is recounted in the twentieth chapter of John and a certain Thomas is quoted as saying, My Lord and My God.

    In interpreting this, Christians maintain that Thomas was addressing Jesus by both of these titles. The Muslim would have no objection to the term Lord.

    As the Bible explains, the word means Master and Sarah is said to have called her husband Abraham by this title (1 Peter 3:6).

    The suggestion that Thomas addressed Jesus as literally being God is a different matter. Jesus had already pointed out that the Hebrew scriptures themselves address men as gods (John 10:34; Psalms 82:6). This would allow for Thomas’ use of the term.

    However, Paul gave new rules in 1 Corinthians chapter 8, saying that there are many lords and gods …yet for us there is but one God, the Father,… and one Lord, Jesus Christ…

    Christians apply this verse to sort out the ambiguities of Thomas’ expression. But now we are left with an unorthodox doctrine, namely that Jesus is the Father.

    This ancient heresy has been branded by the Church as Patripassianism, Moarchianism, or Sebellianism. The impossibility of an orthodox interpretation of Thomas is now apparent.

    The distinction between Father and Son is essential to the doctrine of Trinity.

    The distinction is blurred again when John 14:9 is pressed into service. Here Jesus’ reply to a man named Philip is recorded as He who has seen me has seen the Father.

    A strictly literal explication would mean the unacceptable doctrine that Jesus is the Father. So interpreters say that Father is here equivalent to God. However, we cannot possibly be obliged to understand that Jesus meant to say that seeing him was exactly the same as seeing God because he was God. Our reason is found in the contrariety of John 5:37 You have neither heard His (God) voice at any time nor seen his form.

    8. Jesus is GOD Because He Pre-Existed

    At John 8:58 it is reported that Jesus said, Before Abraham was I am.

    Even if Jesus meant to claim by these words that he was alive before Abraham was, is it sufficient ground to say that he was divine?

    If Jesus lived in heaven then came to the earth it might mean something remarkable, but it would not be enough to establish him as God Christians do not imagine that the prophet Jeremiah had a prehuman existence and find a suitable way of interpreting the words of Jeremiah 1:5 which portrays such a situation, if taken literally.

    However not such similar understanding is permitted by the Church in the case of John 8:58!

    9. Jesus is GOD Because He claims Before Abraham was I am

    In Exodus 3, it is reported that God told Moses I am what I am as most English Bibles translate the Hebrew text. At John 8:58 Jesus says, before Abraham was I am as most English Bibles translate the Greek text.

    But here is the key to another deception. The original of the first text is in Hebrew, while the original of the second is in Greek. All but a few of Jesus’ words are recorded in Greek.

    For two hundred years before the time of Jesus the Jews used a Greek translation of their Hebrew scriptures, the Septuagint. This work translated the key phrase I am of Exodus as HO ON. However, the words of Jesus, I am, have been given in Greek as EGO EMI

    If the gospel writer in John 8:58 wanted to tell his Greek-speaking audience that Jesus had imitated God he would have used the familiar words of the Septuagint.

    10. Jesus is GOD Because He Had The Power To Forgive Sins

    In the second chapter of Mark, Jesus tells a man, Your sins are forgiven (Mark 2:5-10). The fact that Jesus forgave sins is perhaps the action of Jesus which is most commonly seen as being synonymous with divinity since it is argued that only God can forgive sins. The customary interpretation takes the side of the Jews then present who ask, Who can forgive sins but God alone?

    But the verse at John 12:49, among others, explains very well how a man could make such a statement. In this verse Jesus denies any personal initiative. (see also John 8:40; 14:10)

    This same authority to forgive sins is apparently granted to his disciples: If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven… (John 20:23), but it is never suggested that the disciples are thus divine!

    11. Jesus is GOD Because He is The Way, The Truth and The Life

    I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father, but through me.(John 14:6)

    Exactly what this verse is supposed to prove is left vague by the Christian. Does it prove the divinity of Jesus? Is it supposed to mean that God listens to no one except Jesus or those who call on Jesus?

    The dictionary shows that the words “way”, “truth”, and “life” do not automatically carry connotations of divinity. So the Christian insist that the structure of the sentence stresses the way, the truth, and the life, as though Jesus is unique for all time.

    Bill Clinton may have been the American President but he is not the first and probably not the last! So language usage alone does not do the job of proving Jesus’ divinity.

    12. Jesus is GOD Because He Claims That I And The Father Are One

    At John 10:30 Jesus is quoted as saying I and the Father are one. The Greek word translated One is HEN. Certain scholars have insisted that the only possible understanding of this word is One in essence or nature.

    One need not be a Greek scholar to refute this unjustified claim. A counter example is sufficient. The same word is used by Jesus in John 17:11, 21,22,23 as he includes his disciples in this ONEness, whatever the meaning.

    13. Jesus is GOD Because He Possessed Knowledge of All Things

    This is a false claim refuted by Jesus himself: No-one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, NOR THE SON, but only the Father. Matthew 24:36.

    This verse also denies the claim the God and Jesus are ONE is essence or nature.

    14. Jesus is GOD Because He Performed Miracles

    Jesus admitted that the miracles he performed were not by his own power:

    •…All power is GIVEN unto me in heaven. Mat 28:18

    •I cast out devils BY THE SPIRIT OF GOD… Mat 12:28

    •I can of mine OWN SELF do nothing… John 5:30

    All the miracles performed by Jesus have parallels in the Old Testament. For example:

    •Fed the Multitudes: II Kings 4:42-44

    •Healed the lepers and blind: so did others I Kings 5:14; 6:17,20;

    •Acts 3:7; 5:15-16)

    •Brought the dead to life: So did others: I Kings 17:22; II Kings 13:21; Ezek 37:1-14)

    •Rose from the dead: So did others Ezek 37:1-14

    15. Jesus never claimed to be GOD

    And behold! God will say: “O Jesus the son of Mary! Did you say unto men, ‘worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of God?'” He will say: “Glory to you. Never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, You would indeed have known it. You know what is in my heart, though I know not what is in Yours. For you know in full what is hidden. (The Noble Qur’an 5:116)

    They do blaspheme who say “God is the Christ the son of Mary.” But Christ said “O Children of Israel! Worship God, (who is) my Lord and your Lord.” Whosoever joins other gods with God – God will forbid him the Garden, and the fire will be his abode… They do blaspheme who say “God is one of three in a Trinity”. For there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.” (The Noble Qur’an 5:72-73).

  36. Gosh, Gwen, I thought I was being nice about Mormons. I do not see them as a threat but still would not like to live under a LDS dominated society. Too rigid and silly for me.

    A Jack Mormon is a “Mormon in name only” type of person, one that does not really practice or take the church seriously. My Dad used the term often when I was a boy, about some of our neighbors. I have never heard the first usage you mentioned.

    I hope you are not saying I have been telling lies about Mormons or Muslims. You know, Joe Smith was a big fan of Mohammed and mentioned him frequently. There is a lot of similarity between the LDS and Mormons.

    As I said, I don’t see the LDS as problematic for two basic reasons: 1. they are much more honest about the problems with their history and theology (the ‘Mormon Matters’ blog comes to mind) at least among the rank and file; and 2. they don’t do the blame thing (“it is all your fault”) that is constant in any discussion with Muslims. Most will even admit to JS’s many faults and sins, something that a Muslim will never do, no matter how obvious. Oh yes, Mormons don’t kill or persecute people that leave the LDS church or try to silence its critics.

    Since the subject is ‘GOD’ I guess I should ask if you have plans to be one, too (since that is what Mormons believe). Wasn’t that Satan’s original sin – you know, ‘I will be like the most high’ from the book of Isaiah (OT) I believe?

  37. Theologically speaking, the Christian god and the Muslim one cannot be the same. Now if the Jews want to claim that Allah is the same as Jehovah it is up to them. I doubt they would jump on this idea, except maybe in the most liberal communities

    Of course, most Muslims have little understanding of Christianity and what they know is misinformation from the Quran. Seriously, since when did Jesus “give the gospels” as stated. Mohammad had almost no exposure to Christian doctrine and gets almost everything wrong. Even so, both the Quran and Muslims think they are authorities on Christian doctrine, that they have it right and all others are wrong. Fine, except when others return the favor and tell Muslims how silly, inaccurate and evil their doctrine is, Muslims go ballistic. As I have said before, Muslims aren’t very good with criticism. I see this as a lack of intellectual integrity, personal confidence and emotional maturity.

    Yeah, Sami, “no pressure” at all – you just kill ’em if they disbelieve.

  38. Hrm. I’m a little confused about the Christians accepting Mohammed as a prophet part too. I was always taught that Jesus was the final prophet and any after him would be false. There has to be a Bible verse somewhere that corroborates that. I’m sure of it. It’s been many years since I have sat in a church service so I can’t reference it.

    I was brought up not to believe in hell (not a Mormon). Not the fire and brimstone, eternal suffering type anyway. There’s definitely more than one Bible verse that says that only one group of people get to live forever, and those people go to heaven, whatever that may be. The rest might suffer some torment but they don’t get to live forever in it. I was taught they will be forgotten in the afterlife, like they never existed. Who knows what will happen in reality. My only wish was those people who kill themselves in the name of God (whichever version they may believe) could come back for a moment and let their buddies know it’s not the fast-track to heaven they expected. For that I am certain.

    I find it arrogant and insulting that humans think they get to decide who goes to heaven and who goes to hell. That’s something we will never know. I’m sure there will be people we consider mass murderers in heaven and pious godly people in hell. If only we would stop thinking we have the ability to judge others in the same manner as God. I think we’d probably all get along a lot more.

    Anyway, theological beliefs aside, the Jews, Christians and Muslims do worship the same God. They just put a different face and name on the same entity. If we can trace all of these religions back to Abraham I’m pretty sure he didn’t believe in three different Gods and we all just chose one. That’s a huge misunderstanding written into the Quran. The Christians never claimed to believe in a God different to the Jews, they just added Jesus into the equation. His divinity can be questioned, but the God he worshiped can’t.

  39. Stacy here you go:

    “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.”
    Matthew 7:15 (ESV)

    Titan (1-10-14) For there are many rebellious people who engage in useless talk and deceive others. This is especially true of those who insist on circumcision for salvation. 11 They must be silenced, because they are turning whole families away from the truth by their false teaching. And they do it only for money. 12 Even one of their own men, a prophet from Crete, has said about them, “The people of Crete are all liars, cruel animals, and lazy gluttons.”* 13 This is true. So reprimand them sternly to make them strong in the faith. 14 They must stop listening to Jewish myths and the commands of people who have turned away from the truth.

    2 Peter 2:1-3 (NKJV) “But there were also FALSE PROPHETS among the people, even as there will be FALSE TEACHERS among you, who will SECRETLY bring in DESTRUCTIVE HERESIES, even DENYING the LORD who bought them, and bring on themselves SWIFT DESTRUCTION. And MANY will FOLLOW their DESTRUCTIVE WAYS, because of whom the WAY of TRUTH will be BLASPHEMED. By COVETOUSNESS they will EXPLOIT you with DECEPTIVE WORDS; for a LONG TIME their JUDGMENT has NOT been IDLE, and their DESTRUCTION does NOT SLUMBER.”

    There is more this is just a few false prophet sections from the bible.

  40. “Yeah, Sami, “no pressure” at all – you just kill ‘em if they disbelieve.”

    isn’t this what the christians did? inquisition, execution of heretics etc. gnostics were brutally murdered in some cases. I wonder what we would find if we were able to go and count how many Christians have killed in the name of Christ?

    However I don’t want to count because i think you are just being provocative here. Yes there are currently many misguided people calling themselves Muslim and acting in the name of Islam, just like there were many misguided people acting in the name of other religions as well.

    References to prophets after Jesus (3alaihi salam)
    Acts 11: 27-28
    Ephesians 4:11-12

    John 4:1-3
    1. Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3. but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world. (NIV)

    So Mohammad (3alaihi salam) is one of the spirits/prophets to be believed because he did recognize that Jesus was Christ and that he came and lived in the flesh, sent by God.

    Jesus (3alaihi salam) cannot be the last prophet if he tells us how to identify the correct prophets after him…

  41. “Even so, both the Quran and Muslims think they are authorities on Christian doctrine, that they have it right and all others are wrong. Fine, except when others return the favor and tell Muslims how silly, inaccurate and evil their doctrine is, Muslims go ballistic. As I have said before, Muslims aren’t very good with criticism. I see this as a lack of intellectual integrity, personal confidence and emotional maturity.”

    To address the first issue, it is difficult for many Muslims to understand the vast and varying doctrines of Christianity. When a Muslim asks “what do Christians believe about …” I find there is no good way to answer them because every group (of which there are hundreds) will have a different answer/belief/explanation. If they hear that Christian A believes some concept, they will tend to think that all Christians believe this concept. Just as many people hear that Muslim B believes some concept, so therefore all Muslims believe in said concept. This is erroneous thinking on both sides.

    I find the rest of this statement to be completely insulting. I am a Muslim and have NEVER gone “ballistic” before, especially when talking about religion as the Qur’an says to argue in the best way. I find your blanket statement about intellectual integrity, personal confidence and emotional maturity to be a personal attack and one that is not deserved.

  42. @sami – what am i supposed to be careful not to fail … fail what, fail whom.

    Not to sound arrogant, but i’m going to anyway. With GOD’s help i try and save lives lives everyday, I don’t do people harm, i don’t cause grief to anyone, i didn’t and don’t plan to kill anyone, steal from anyone. I try to be good , try to help people and the poor and even once in a great while do things out of the goodness of my heart 🙂

    so i think irrespective of which god i follow or not, If there is such a thing as heaven i’ve a pretty good shot at it. ( ya ya i know arrogance ), so i don’t know what you mean by FAIL…

    be good, do good . beyong that nothing matters.

  43. NeverEver, it’s disgusting how many people have killed in the name of Christ especially since he neither taught us to do that or lived that way. Certainly we didn’t get that teaching from Jesus, but from our own evil inclinations.

    ————————————————-

    Saudi Jeans has this interesting post about a Saudi writer who dared to admit he didn’t admire everything about Muhammad. Maybe there is more to the story, but he is being chastened for daring to say such a thing. And people say Muhammad is not god, yet he is supposed to be perfect or at least his imperfections not admitted? I hope you can see why we nonMuslims are at times confused. If Muhammad is merely a human, it’s perfectly fine to admit he sinned on occasion. He did.

    http://saudijeans.org/2012/02/08/hamza-kashgari/

  44. @ Andrea …
    “One question, I don’t remember any Christian being taught that Muhammad (PBUH) is a prophet…I was raised Catholic, and I never learned about Muhammad (PBUH)…are there any Christians religions out there that believe that Muhammad (PBUH) is a prophet?”

    I was raised in the United Church. We were taught a little about Islam and Judaism in Sunday school. We WERE taught that Mohamed was a prophet just as Jesus was and we were taught to respect all religions and that we all shared the same God.

  45. Re: Saudi writer flees threats for “offending Islam”

    I understand Hamza Kashgri’s crime is comparing his poetry to something in the Koran and Mohammedan sayings. The Koran is adamant that Allah and Mohammed cannot be rivaled (2:23).

    One report even says King Abdullah has ordered his extradition and his arrest. That’s the same King Abdullah of the “King Abdullah Bin Abdulaziz International Centre for Interreligious and Intercultural Dialogue,” not in Mecca or Medina or even Riyadh, but Vienna.

    I bet Mr. Kashgri will be extradited to wherever he may be and then beheaded. Whatever happended to “there is no compulsion in religion” :)-

  46. Slaamo-Alaikum, Mariah,

    I agree with you. I read it though it is a long thesiss. You have explained the truth nicely and openly. Benefit goes to —who tries to understand without prejudice.
    Actually the project is “Do Christians and Muslims worship the same God”. Simpel answer is “NO<NO<NO"Christians are confused. Some
    say FATHER is god,some say SON is god and others say HOLY SPIRIT is god.Some worship FATHER,some worship SON and others worship HOLY GHOST.
    I quote " So I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men., but the blasphemy against the SPIRIT will not be forgiven. Any one who speaks a word against the Son Of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the HOLY SPiRIT will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come" (Mathew12:31-32)
    Muslims believe that "anyone who speaks a word and ascribe a partner with ALLAH, will not be fogiven, because HE is ONE.

    THINK< THINK AND THINK
    before the age to come.

  47. Mariah,

    Your second post on the divinity of Jesus through the Bible is a very interesting read. You are correct that pure Biblical Christianity has been modified to suit the powerful and that is truly a sad thing.

    Your first post about Islam, however, was not as eloquent. It is full of circular arguments, which are far from convincing. “Islam is the pure religion because we have a holy text which claims to be directly from God and it says so.” Claiming your religion is right because you say so is a great read for the converted, but completely unconvincing for those who are interested to learn about why.

    For a number of those topics you could change the Islamic references to Jewish or Christian ones and they would have the exact same impact for each religion. The pure forms of each of these religions are lovely and accepting and just. But even you know that Islam has been modified to suit the powerful in the modern age. There is not one Islam that is being practiced in the world, there are many forms and interpretations. They use the same holy texts (as the Christians and Jews do also) but interpret them very differently to suit their purpose.

    It would be nice for a change if the anti-Christian arguments were not focused completely on the Roman Catholic church doctrine. I understand when most of these arguments were being formed in the early days of Islam they were the predominant Christian theology but times have changed and if Islam is for all times then it should be able to change its arguments to suit modern times.

  48. Never, Quote: “I find your blanket statement about intellectual integrity, personal confidence and emotional maturity to be a personal attack and one that is not deserved.”

    Oh, so you think that MUslims understand the concept of peaceful dialogue? Where exactly is this happening? To them, any idea that they dislike becomes “hate speech” or racism. They use every means at their disposal to suppress free speech. And I am not even talking about Islamic societies and their apostasy / blasphemy laws or their treatment of non-NMuslims.

    1. intellectual integrity. Want to talk abourt MOhammad’s wars on his neighbors? His attacks? The plunder, murder, enslavement, and rape? Please indicate a Muslim site that discusses these based upon Islam’s own texts. This is just that – a lack of intellectual honesty.

    2. Personal confidence. I think the need to silence any criticism of Islam says it all about this point. Note that Muslims need to see Islam as ever triumphant, with millions of new converts and yes, famous people too. It is a matter of lack of confidence.

    3. emotional maturity. This is about the ability to accept responsibility for ones actions and beliefs. Muslims have no ability to self-reflect or to consider their actions in terms of their impact on others. Once again, Muslims want for themselves what they deny to others, hence the need to blame all problems on others (jews, media, a few bad apples, islamophobia, racism, colonialism, ignorance, culture, etc…)

    Tell me, NeverEver, will you accept that the Quran is full of hate and violence and that Mohammad did horrible, imoral things (based on Islam’s own writings)?

  49. How about we just accept that all of it is a bunch of BS and make believe? There is as much divinity in Christianity as there is Islam exactly zero. Let just say that the white spot on top of a chicken’s dropping is still parting of it’s droppings. Heck maybe in 200 years non-thinking sheep will believe that Harry Potter is a book of mystism that God gave us to fully understand good and evil.

  50. Certainly the Prophet Mohammad believed it was the same god- therefore Muslims would believe that. Some Christians also believe that some do not. Those that do not are generally of two types. Those that have no idea what Islam is about and those that virulently hate Islam and what it to be a separate thing completely- they want no common ground. *This is based on my experience- not on a scientific fact-finding mission of research.

    Regarding Mohammed in the bible, some Muslims believe the verses in the Gospel of John referring to the Paraclete are referring to Mohammad. Christians think it is the Holy Spirit and many bibles translate it that way- though that’s not what it says.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraclete

  51. @ Mariah

    Please cool down. Relax. You are right what you said, still the title of the project is simpe and straight forward. The reply should be straight forward too.

  52. Re: Saudi writer flees threats for “offending Islam”. He has been arrested in Malaysia and will be deported back to Saudi Arabia for a show trial and beheading.

    http://www.emirates247.com/news/region/sacrilegious-saudi-writer-arrested-in-malaysia-2012-02-09-1.442198

  53. @mariah

    You state a number of things which are not accurate:

    “Additionally, in Islam there are no priests or clergy”

    Now in Shiite Islam one would have to call the ayatollahs a clergy. Islam may not have a formal priesthood as Catholicism does but with the clerical scholars and those who lead prayer in mosques do function as a clergy even if not formally ordained in the manner of a Catholic Priest.

    “No other religion has a scripture which is both as old and as well-preserved as the one possessed by Muslims today. Even scholars who are hostile to Islam admit that the Qur’an that exists today is exactly the same as the one that existed in the time of the Prophet Muhammad.”

    The Koran seems to be reasonably consistent over the years but no more so than the Masoretic text of the Jewish bible. There is no way to know what Mohammed actually recited and there is no way to prove the current Koran is the original text.

    The idea the the Koran is anything other than a man-made text is something that is a matter of belief not a fact. I doubt that any non-believer scholar who studies the Koran would be able to state that is it the same on that existed at the time of Mohammed

  54. Re: Saudi faces calls for his death after criticizing Muhammad

    The blasphemy laws are alive and well in Saudi Arabia. Those who say that they have no part of Sharia as it comes to the West are not being honest; there is no school of Islamic jurisprudence that does not call for death for blasphemy. Muslims are lying big time when they quote Koran that “there is no compulsion in religion”.

    On the occasion of Muhammed’s birthday last week, 23-year-old Hamza Kashgari tweeted: “I have loved things about you and I have hated things about you and there is a lot I don’t understand about you. I will not pray for you”.

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/technology/saudi-faces-death-calls-after-prophet-tweets/story-fn7celvh-1226267495070

  55. We are not lying. There are many of us that find things in Sharia are a perversion of what they should be. Things interpreted through a very tribal lense. Personally I believe in separation of church and state. I think history has proven than man cannot be trusted to speak for God.

  56. NeverEver, I see you haven’t answered my question… But I am not surprised. This whole issue is very well illustrated by the Kashgri tweet controversy.

    What this teaches is that Muslims have one standard for themselves and Islam, and another for everyone else. The fact is, as I have often said, that Mohammad did terrible, evil things. The description of these horrible things do not come from Islam’s victims or enemies, but from Muslims’ most reliable accounts, across multiple sources. Worse yet, all of these transgressions are expressly permitted in the Quran.

    Yet when we ask Muslims about these vile actions, they either make excuses or ignore us. To make matters worse, the Quran says, without limitations, reservations or restrictions, that Mohmmed is a noble example for Muslims to follow.

    So It seems to say that murder, plunder, lying, enslavement of women, women and children, rape, and torture are ok depending on the circumstances — particularly if done by Muslims or Mohammed.

    So a writer/blogger writes a few words to suggest that some things done by Islam’s prophet might not be nice and Muslims go bloody crazy.

    As one comment in the SaudiJeans post says: “Yes, Muhammad (pbuh) was human, but didnt sin. Muhammad’s charactaristics and attitude were the main reasons to follow him at his time and nowadays. Anyway, this poor youngman insulted God and his existance in previous tweets, but his lasts blew up the firestorm in the muslim community.” So those actions – such as attacking peaceful villages at dawn, burning crops, taking 50% of work produce, killing people, raping women and even letting a man rip open a pregnant woman are not really sins according to Muslims….

    In all my years I have never seen a Muslim condemn any of these horrible actions done by their dear prophet. Guess what this means for us infidels….

    Notice also, as already commented, that insulting Allah is not a problem but woe unto anybody that even insinuates that Mohammed was anything but pure holy gold. It is obvious that Allah is a mere has-been, secondary god while Islam’s prophet in fact is the true God of Islam and Muslims. It is also obvious that Muslims are never honest about Islam and its values.

    bad times are coming…

    PS: let me correct myself… I have actually met a few Muslims that will say that their prophet’s actions are “problematic” or ’cause concern’. Of course, this is in private to an infidel. I don’t consider the Quran-only Muslims to be serious because although they solve part of this problem by throwing out the history and traditions, they still have assume responsibility for the 1. hate and violence in the Quran, 2. the actions of Muslims today, 3. the fact that these Quran-only Muslims refuse to address these issues with ‘regular’ Muslims and 4. they associate freely with those Muslims who consider Mohammad a noble example.

  57. Sadly he was arrested in Malaysia. I find it unfathomable that Intepol was looking for him over this.

  58. All this poor guy Kashgri did was write a few lines of prose in honor of Mohammed:

    On your birthday I will say that I have loved the rebel in you,
    that you’ve always been a source of inspiration to me,
    and that I do not like the halos of divinity around you.

    I shall not pray for you.

    On your birthday I find you wherever I turn.
    I will say that I have loved aspects of you, hated others,
    and could not understand many more.

    I shall not bow to you. I shall not kiss your hand.
    Rather, I shall shake it as equals do, and smile at
    you as you smile at me.

    I shall speak to you as a friend, no more.

    I do not anything disrespectful towards Mohammed in his prose. But then again what do I know …. I am an atheist.

    How many things can one think of in Saudi society that would actually be worth this much outrage? Child marriage? Sexual abuse of foreign domestic workers? The treatment of women as permanent minors? Antisemitic preaching and textbooks? Persecution of non-Muslims?

    One could go on and on. But the righteous indignation and beheading is reserved for a 23-year-old with a Twitter account. :)-

  59. Well Muslims believe that an angel told Muhammed that Jesus is not the Son of God. This could have happened yes. But, that angel in my opinion would have been an angle of the devil.

    Also I belief the God of Islam is the devil, as the devil is the father of all lies, and what Islam teaches is not in the bible.

    So not the same God, One god, one devil.

    This is my opinion i cannot refer you to the bible, as it doesn’t even mention Islam or Muhammed. But Jesus did warn us of false prophets.

  60. @Gavin of october19,2013
    “You said God of Islam is the Devil” I think you are committing BLASPHEMY which is not acceptable to any one Neither Christians nor Muslims,nor Jews.
    You should be careful. If you have no knowledge—–keep quiet.

  61. Sami,

    Blasphemy is nothing more than any speech that offends somebody. The Quran is full of verses that are offensive to non-Muslims and that denigrate them and their religions. As such, you have no right to tell others to be quiet.

    In fact, the word “careful” sounds like a threat to me. Do you want to tell me to be careful, also? Do you think that I don’t have the right to a sincere opinion? (see above post) Nothing brings out the mean in me like a threat…..

    This need for silencing critics and even for agression against non-Muslims is all too typical of Islam, everywhere.

    So this poor guy Kashgri is finally free this week, condemned for no other reason than being honest about his feelings and reaction to Islam’s own traditions. How any Muslims can not fell shame about those writings, I don’t know. I certainly have never found one that can justify the actions of islam’s prophet. Justify, no, make endless excuses, yes.

    Note that I don’t have a clue if the god of Islam and the devil are on and the same. Could be, probably not. Ain’t part of my expertise or life experience.

  62. When determining an answer to a simple question, such as “Do Muslims and Christians worship the same God?”, I think that you just look to what they say about their God. They both say God is an all-knowing Creator of the universe that is in all things and made up of all things (similar to other ideas of an ultimate creative life force found in almost all other religions). So I would say, that, yes, they worship the same God who is supposed to represent goodness, light, and most importantly- love. I believe that anyone who embraces the positive energy and light (i.e. love) in the world believes in and worships the same God (no matter what you call that God). That is my belief.

    The rituals of each religion might be different, but at their core they were all meant to, at some point, direct people back to the positive energy of the universe. Of course, over time governments and other similar groups have used religion as a way to control their population, which then tends to instill more negative beliefs into their people such as racism, prejudice against other religions, ethnic cleansing, etc. Of course, sometimes religion (as long as it isn’t limited to one particular group/faction) can be used in a good way, such as bringing people together from different backgrounds for group meditation/prayer in the face of tragedies and offering encouragement. Culture, in combination with religion, can also push people to donate more around major holidays such as Eid and Christmas. Churches and mosques also help out poor families in their general area (or at least, they were meant to according to their religious beliefs).

  63. No Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God. Christians worship a man called Jesus who is also the son of god. The god of Muslims is One, Unique, does not beget nor was begotten and He is like none. That is the description of Muslim God and it is not the same as the one whom Christians worship (who is made in man’s image). Muslims love and respect Messiah Isa who will be coming back to correct the false notions that people have about him.

  64. Wrong Sarah.
    The Jews, Christians and Muslims all worship the same God. Jesus is equivalent to Mohammad in Christianity.

  65. @WendyOf 11 November
    You are confused, Wendy. If Jesus is equivalent to Mohammad, then Jesus is prophet and neither god nor son of god nor Holy Spirit.
    You should be out of this confusion then think whom you worship?

  66. I am not confused at all.

  67. Wendy, Jesus is one of the important messenger of God. In this way he is like Prophet Muhammad. He is not god nor son of god. He was a miracle. If Christians worship the one true God Who is like nothing He created, Who is too great to be seen, yes then it is the same god but until now Jesus is still worshipped as god and son of god at the same time.

    Both prophets bought messages sent to them by God as all other messengers did.

  68. My point was that there is one God called God or Allah or Yewah according to what language is used. There are not two or three Gods. The Muslims, Jews and Christians all have the same God. Jesus is not God and nobody says he is.

  69. I agree with you that there is one God not two or three. If Christians and Jews worship only this one God and call no other “god”, then yes we all have the same One. But the second you start calling a man or thing god (or make idols or images) and start praying to it, then that is where we part our commonality.

  70. sarah, the same god of islam is the same as jews and christians. it is in the books if you read them. they have a similar stories. and the christians are recognized as lost, so, yes, they are as we know eating pork and saying jesus is son of god. why do you think islam came along. to clean up a nation that needed faith. this is in a short statement. just keep reading your books and dont be so critical and closed up. relax.

    and besides you probably grew up christian and you turned out fine. now dont rain on their parade like youre better.

  71. g, I certainly agree with you that in the ORIGINAL Book, we all worship the same god – but I was talking about the current Christians who think Jesus is god.

    BTW, g, dear I know my books. I am critical of those who say that the God is same because it is so obvious He is not the same as Jesus. So please you do not be so critical and be so quick to judge. I am not raised as a Christian, fyi

  72. Of course when it says in the bible ‘ son of god’ it does not mean ‘ son’ in the way we perceive it in every day life, i.e. my husband has 2 boys.

    It is clearly methaphorical to show the connection prophets had with God.

    There is under no circumstances polytheism in christianity.

    If some current christians have mixed it up, then it is their own fault and the fault of the one who taught them- eg a faulty local religious teacher, school teacher without good knowledge, etc

    The message is clear and written many times in all christian prayers that god is one and in my humble opinion it is the same god in all monotheistic religions at least.

  73. Gigi, that’s true. If Christians are true followers of Christ then they have to follow what he said. He never said he is one of the three. In fact the word “trinity” never occurs in the bible and Jesus never said he was god or one of the three.

    There is only one God.

  74. I think in the past, the term “son of God” actually was a reference to religious leader or something like that, which is eventually what led to confusion. I would need an historian to help me out here. I was raised Christian and my parents taught me never to pray to Jesus because he was, more or less, simply a prophet (thought it was said in other ways). It says so in the BIble, and also says that there is only one God. However, it is also true that some churches nowadays pray to “Jesus”, which doesn’t make any sense, even according to their book. One of the main things Jesus was supposed to have taught was that men didn’t need religious leaders to pray to God for them; they could go pray directly to God/Allah themselves. So, why then, would a Christian pray to anyone other than God/Allah? Of course, then you have Catholicism vs. Protestantism which have a couple major differences.

  75. there is only one creator of the earth and what is on it. end of story. next is the good and the bad of us. everything in the books is written with examples of ”if this is done, this is what happens.” so, associating your creator whether you are jew, christian or muslim will be written in the books we carry in our homes. most born muslims dont dwell on this because they were raise and all ready know the difference because it is in the quran. it is the reverts that get the eye openers going and cant quite get it. so, yes, people who worship the same god do sin.for what ever reason, and possibly the same in massive.

  76. We agree that God is One and that Jesus is not god but a messenger of God like other messengers except that he was also a miracle. It was Paul who later changed the concept of god and created the confusion.

  77. However important to keep in mind the vast majority of Christians at the time of the Prophet were trinitarian and believed in the divinity of Jesus Christ. Including the Ethiopian Church, the Copts and the Christians in Najran.

    Many Muslims seem to think Christianity changed in modern times. It changed 300 years BEFORE Muhammed- though there were and have always been some pockets of those that are not Trinitarian.

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